Army Drops Universal Camouflage After Spending Billions

RichM

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Dench said:
The people that forced ACU of Multicam should be in jail.

Most retarded cammo scheme ever. All the photos I have of me in the .mil doing stupid shit wherever have all the soldiers in ACU sticking out no matter the background. We might as well of worn friggen neon orange.

We DO wear neon... I once joked that all the enemy needed to do was shoot the road guards and we couldn't go anywhere... but it wasn't really a joke.

They've been promising a PT uniform that doesn't require a reflective belt for a decade now; the Air Force managed one, the Army still hasn't fielded theirs yet, so we get stuck with 3 different style reflective belts in 4 different colors, any of which are acceptable.

Using Forum Runner. Please excuse spelling errors, formatting, and absent links.
 
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Scarecrow

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ACU's actually worked fairly well in Iraq when I was there, I have had guys just kind of vanish while overwatching roads from cover.

But Iraq is grey and covered in trash, so that is about the only place I can imagine it working. Why don't they just get over it and issue everyone ghillie suits? Or maybe we could all just wear man dresses and then they would never know we didn't belong! The sandals will be a bastard to get used to, and that whole "wiping your butt with your left hand" thing...
 
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Now if this piece of mental retardation would go away as well.....

USN_NWU1.jpg


Dumbass can't even stand at attention correctly

What are you talking about? That camo works very well. I bet you would have a very hard time seeing him if he fell overboard

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Why don't the good folks at Natick Army Labs just take a trip to Cabelas? Real Tree and Mossy Oak seems to get the whole camouflage thing better than the military.

Personally I think the cammo they sell at Cabelas, Bass pro, etc is fugly. The Army should go back to good old Woodland Cammo, berets, and SHINY black boots. Seriously, whatever happened to taking pride in your uniform, having your patches sewed on, uniformed pressed, and boots shined?
 
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Personally I think the cammo they sell at Cabelas, Bass pro, etc is fugly. The Army should go back to good old Woodland Cammo, berets, and SHINY black boots. Seriously, whatever happened to taking pride in your uniform, having your patches sewed on, uniformed pressed, and boots shined?

I'd rather have camo that works than looks pretty.
 
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I think your right. At the Harvard new members meeting, a woman introduced herself and said she was a lead developer in creating a new camo for the Army.

Yes. Natick labs does it. I had a client who had a degree in clothing design and she was working on the new NBC uniform.
 
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I guess when you're back in the rear with the gear, Sta-Flo and Leather Luster are your most important weapons. [wink]

Well if you mean that up in a turret behind a .50 then yes I guess I am in the rear with the gear. My desert camo worked well in Iraq, the problem was the GREEN un-armored turtle back humvees they gave us. When you're back stateside, you should have to shine your boots and press your uniform...it's all about pride in the uniform you're putting on everyday. I just don't understand why they decided to take that out of the equation when they went to velcro patches and leather suede boots. It's like they wanted to dumb it down, make it easier?
 
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I tried to stay out of this since I work at Natick Labs but I'll throw my PERSONAL opinion in here.
(NOT IN ANY WAY ENDORSED OR REPRESENTATIVE OF US ARMY POLICY)​
Ten years ago during the original testing, the UCP (ACU) pattern did not test well overall. It did very well in urban environments, particularly in the Middle East. That was the focus of Army Doctrine. The Multi-cam pattern did test high throughout multiple environments. HOWEVER, that pattern was a patented pattern owned by Crye Industries. Crye offered to allow the Military to use the pattern at a cost per uniform that would have TRIPLED the cost of the uniform! That 8 billion would have been 24 billion. Additionally, they (Crye) did not want to allow outside vendors to manufacture the uniforms or associated TA-50, but they were not able to manufacture everything themselves at that time. So it would have been a long spin up to meet requirements.
The decision to issue that pattern in Afghanistan (and only in Afghanistan as of now) is based on 1.) significant improvement over the UCP in country, 2.) the variety of terrains and environments in country (lowland lush green valleys to rocky mountain) 3.) the expiration of the Crye pattern allowing for the US Army to seek out additional supplies reducing costs.

As for the other Services (since they're testing is done here as well), the Navy went with their "camo" uniform to serve aboard ships, NOT to use in combat theaters. The pattern was chosen because it hid oil and other stains (common among Sailors) thereby increasing the wearlife of the uniform. No more having to replace your shirt every time you get a drop of something on it. It also launders better and has a better lifespan.
The USMC uniforms...yes they have two color schemes. It would make sense, EXCEPT for the issues with TA-50 and other equipment. Basically, it boils down to money/cost. Do you issue every Marine two different sets of TA-50, one for DCU and one for BDU? THe current issue (Coyote Brown) works with both patterns but completely ruins the camo effect. Back to the same issue.

The Military has done extensive testing on commercial patterns. Most did well in one area or another but overall, they don't do that well. Some of the patterns that tested well here in Mass, failed miserably in VA. The nature of camoflauge.

As for the old Woodland pattern, shiny boots, and berets...The only place that the Woodland camo was/is effective is the Fulda Gap in Germany. That was the only place that it was ever tested or intended to be worn. It's a Cold War relic that needed to be replaced. The shiny boots issue is a cost factor. The only place for shiny boots is in Garrison. Are you going to issue two sets of boots for Garrison and two sets for field? It's the same with the beret. It has NO lifespan (I killed one typically every four-six months) and was COMPLETELY worthless for any form of outside activity (field, motorpool, etc). Yes, it looks nice on a poster and in a ceremony if it's done correctly, but good luck with that. The reason that dry-cleaning the ACU and newer uniforms is banned (just like it was originally with the BDUs) is that the process completely eliminates the IR reducing and build in bug replenent. It bleaches out the coloring ("cook whites") and makes the uniform combat ineffective. Once again, it's a cost factor.

Do I personally think that the US Army should look at multiple patterns for multiple environments? Yes I do. But I'm also a realist that understands the costs and logistical issues that go into that.

If the decision to go with the Multi-cam pattern is made, then that's great. Of the 86 different patterns that we've tested (commercial, foreign, and protoypes), it consistently tested the best at all of the areas we tested it, both CONUS and OCONUS. BUT, we have to remember that technology and camofluage is always changing. There will always be something else in the pipeline.

Aloha

(NOT IN ANY WAY ENDORSED OR REPRESENTATIVE OF US ARMY POLICY)​
 

Bill Nance

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Funny, we can spend a couple of TRILLION dollars on the wars, but we can't manage to field a uniform that is "camouflage." Maybe, I dunno, go back to plain old OD, as that's reasonably NOT a big shining light and reasonably "camo" in pretty much any environment compared to the neon signs we are fitting many of our troops to.

Seriously, this is a trivial problem with a trivial solution that we spent eight BILLION dollars on that failed miserably. It's a GD disgrace.
 

Boghog1

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I was looking to pain my jeep a camo a few years back and came across a company that was trying to sell a pattern it cam up with, it was the most effective camo I had ever seen, the colors seemed to change depending on the background and it had minimal hard edges between the colors. I went so far as to send them an email and they actually responded but I didn't have the coin they were looking for I should go through my old emails and see if I can find the name for it.
 
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Funny, we can spend a couple of TRILLION dollars on the wars, but we can't manage to field a uniform that is "camouflage." Maybe, I dunno, go back to plain old OD, as that's reasonably NOT a big shining light and reasonably "camo" in pretty much any environment compared to the neon signs we are fitting many of our troops to.

Seriously, this is a trivial problem with a trivial solution that we spent eight BILLION dollars on that failed miserably. It's a GD disgrace.

Well we could give the Pentagon another 700 billion so they could remedy this situation...
 
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I tried to stay out of this since I work at Natick Labs but I'll throw my PERSONAL opinion in here.
(NOT IN ANY WAY ENDORSED OR REPRESENTATIVE OF US ARMY POLICY)
...​

If the decision to go with the Multi-cam pattern is made, then that's great. Of the 86 different patterns that we've tested (commercial, foreign, and protoypes), it consistently tested the best at all of the areas we tested it, both CONUS and OCONUS. BUT, we have to remember that technology and camofluage is always changing. There will always be something else in the pipeline.

Aloha

(NOT IN ANY WAY ENDORSED OR REPRESENTATIVE OF US ARMY POLICY)​
I've always seen news specials on that place... Having grown up with parents working at Lincoln labs and draper labs I've always wanted to visit there. Do they ever do any open houses there(I am aware it is a military post) would love to come see the cool stuff in there
 
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i never understood why the navy needed camo either. Every picture i see of Naval Personnel on land in combat zones had the older camo the army use to wear. So the need for the new camo was what?
 
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Trying to eraase the Village People from the mind of the masses.

after college the navy offered me a commission, and a job in logistics on a carrier....
i was tempted... but i don't think i could stand having "in the navy" stuck in my head 24/7

in retrospect i probably should have taken the offer up...
 

Garys

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after college the navy offered me a commission, and a job in logistics on a carrier....
i was tempted... but i don't think i could stand having "in the navy" stuck in my head 24/7

in retrospect i probably should have taken the offer up...

MMA grad?
 
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If the Navy needed camo wouldn't gray be the color? Got to admit tho, as ugly as the blue camos are they beat the bell bottems I have to wear for a decade.

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This is supposed to be a real working uniform ( painting ) . Paint/ grease spotting is not supposed to be an issue when wearing this uniform . What the hell happened to using coveralls ?

The coveralls are still worn aboard ship and in the immediate area of the pier only - it's up to the command on which to wear (or both).

I thought the blue Navy cammies were already being phased out.

No. There are specific patterns for expeditionary units for woodland and desert that were introduced in the last couple of years.

i never understood why the navy needed camo either. Every picture i see of Naval Personnel on land in combat zones had the older camo the army use to wear. So the need for the new camo was what?

The BDUs are no longer authorized and have been replaced by the NWU Type II and III.
 

OB1Kenobi

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ACU's don't breath at all. I sweat wearing them when it's 75 degrees. When it was 125 degrees......well......it just sucked.

i'll take my ACU's over the DCU / BDU any day. [laugh]

as for the "phase out, the ACU was a merger of the DCU and BDU so it made sense at the time... i guess. but that is what we were briefed. now that OIF is done, back to the drawing board.
 
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