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ar15 pistol's
- Thread starter fiddly_foo
- Start date
Short barreled rifles are allowed here in CT but there are some catches. Rifles with barrel lengths between 12 inches and 16 inches are legal with the proper federal/ATF paperwork. Once you go below 12 inches in rifle/shotgun barrel length the firearm is classified as a pistol by the state, and it then subject to the pistol portion of the CT AWB. If the AR barrel is shorter than 12 inches you run into the problem of; the magazine being outside of the pistol grip (AWB evil feature) and possibly having "a manufactured weight of fifty ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded" (another AWB evil feature).
Definition: PISTOL or REVOLVER
Sec. 53-202a. Assault weapons: Definition.
Definition: PISTOL or REVOLVER
Sec. 53-202a. Assault weapons: Definition.
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SO If I have my ct permit the only ar pistol I can buy is if it is under 50oz empty how the hell will that happen there all like 41/2 pounds at least.... freaking damn... ok looks like a SBR really on that 12" for sbr I thought as long as the lower isn't a pistol lower I can have a 10 and 8.5" barrel on it as long as I go through tthe atf and pay the $200 dollar fee and all that fun crap.. Had no idea 12" was the leanght for a sbr...
Twigg
NES Member
Somebody will correct me if I'm wrong but for an SBR;
IIRC Federal law states anything less than 16" needs a stamp.
dcmdon
NES Member
If a stock is not affixed, it is a pistol as far as the Feds and the NFA are concerned. No stamp needed.
To get around the weight issue and the CT AWB you need to build it on a pre-ban non-colt receiver. They can be had these days for a lot less then a couple of years ago. Figure $500 for the receiver and you will be safe.
There are typically some in the classifieds.
I know someone who bought a built up receiver for $450 recently. When you figure in the lower parts kid and stock, he got the receiver for under $300. So we're talking about a total premium of roughly $150 over a regular gun. Not too bad.
To get around the weight issue and the CT AWB you need to build it on a pre-ban non-colt receiver. They can be had these days for a lot less then a couple of years ago. Figure $500 for the receiver and you will be safe.
There are typically some in the classifieds.
I know someone who bought a built up receiver for $450 recently. When you figure in the lower parts kid and stock, he got the receiver for under $300. So we're talking about a total premium of roughly $150 over a regular gun. Not too bad.
I'd consider a preban receiver as an investment in this state. They will only get more expensive with time.
Now... please excuse me, I have to get back to making my time machine.. I'll be back from 1986 with arm fulls of registered auto sears shortly....
Now... please excuse me, I have to get back to making my time machine.. I'll be back from 1986 with arm fulls of registered auto sears shortly....
dcmdon
NES Member
Another couple of points on the pre-ban receiver. Don't be afraid of tier 2 or 3 manufacturers. The lower receiver on an AR does very little. It takes almost no stress associated with firing the rifle. All that matters is that its dimensionally correct. I've seen olympic receivers for not a lot of dough.
Other points. In CT, the receiver does not every have to have built into a rifle prior to the ban date. This is different from CA and I'm not sure about MA.
Also, shame on me for not providing a link to the statute in my previous post: http://www.jud.ct.gov/JI/criminal/glossary/assaultweapon.htm
Finally, something I've found recently. There is a CT statute that says that any rifle with a bbl less than 12" is considered a handgun.
So if you built an AR SBR of 12" or less on a post ban lower, it would be considered a handgun and would be constrained by the weight portion of the CT AWB.
I doubt anyone would ever be arrested for something like this . Its way too convoluted when you consider that most cops don't know the laws. But it is the law.
Most likely its an unintended consequence of a statute whose purpose was to make the paperwork associated with the acquisition of SBRs more rigorous.
Here's another unintended consequence of this law. CT law states that you can not carry a loaded rifle or shotgun in your car. However, by CT law, a 11.5" SBR is considered a handgun.
So by CT law, it is legal for you to carry a SBR in your car, loaded, provided the bbl is less than 12" , which makes it legally a handgun.
Fun huh??
Other points. In CT, the receiver does not every have to have built into a rifle prior to the ban date. This is different from CA and I'm not sure about MA.
Also, shame on me for not providing a link to the statute in my previous post: http://www.jud.ct.gov/JI/criminal/glossary/assaultweapon.htm
Finally, something I've found recently. There is a CT statute that says that any rifle with a bbl less than 12" is considered a handgun.
So if you built an AR SBR of 12" or less on a post ban lower, it would be considered a handgun and would be constrained by the weight portion of the CT AWB.
I doubt anyone would ever be arrested for something like this . Its way too convoluted when you consider that most cops don't know the laws. But it is the law.
Most likely its an unintended consequence of a statute whose purpose was to make the paperwork associated with the acquisition of SBRs more rigorous.
Here's another unintended consequence of this law. CT law states that you can not carry a loaded rifle or shotgun in your car. However, by CT law, a 11.5" SBR is considered a handgun.
So by CT law, it is legal for you to carry a SBR in your car, loaded, provided the bbl is less than 12" , which makes it legally a handgun.
Fun huh??
Twigg
NES Member
Almost as much fun as the MA laws. Good post.
dcmdon
NES Member
Its very difficult to have a legal one. Here's the deal.
A post ban AR pistol is just about impossible to build without running afoul of the AWB.
When it comes to pre-94-ban ARs, there were roughly zero made in a pistol configuration.
The ATF says that once something has been made as a rifle, it can't be made into a pistol.
So unless you can find a pre-94 ban AR that was originally sold as a pistol, you are out of luck.
A post ban AR pistol is just about impossible to build without running afoul of the AWB.
When it comes to pre-94-ban ARs, there were roughly zero made in a pistol configuration.
The ATF says that once something has been made as a rifle, it can't be made into a pistol.
So unless you can find a pre-94 ban AR that was originally sold as a pistol, you are out of luck.
dcmdon
NES Member
Great advice. They are experts at coming up with compliant solutions that make Dan Malloy's head spin. They will make you a "firearm" that meets all the AWB requirements but is essentially what you want.
Thanks as always gents. I'm actually in pretty good shape in CT. for now - thanks to advise from Don a few years back. The current thought exercise I am undertaking pertains to the feasibility of acquiring a pistol as a CT. resident that would exclusively live out of state - in a state with very few, if any restrictions on that type of build. Being that the state I am referring to does recognize my CT. CCW I am now thinking of doing a pistol build from an 80% lower & registering it as such with CT & ATF. Since I would not assemble it into any configuration (other than adding a lower parts kit) in the state of CT the lower itself remains legal as a pistol, right? I can transport the pistol lower to the other state and then assemble it into a complete pistol there. My goal is to remain 100% legal. Does this seem to be a feasible scenario? The only area of concern I see (with my current knowledge base) is potential "constructive possession" issues if the finished lower is registered to and/or stored, for any period of time, at the same address as other compatible parts that could make it an "assault weapon" or illegal (>50oz.) pistol. I know "constructive possession" is a federal concept so not sure if it applies in CT. As always, any feedback is appreciated.
dcmdon
NES Member
Mardoy - just a heads up. If you own a weekend or vacation home in that state, you ARE a resident of that state as far as the ATF is concerned when you are using that home, and can legally buy an AR pistol over the counter in that state, provided they are legal to buy in teh first place.
For example, if your place is in VT, you are good to go. If your place is in upstate NY, you are not.
If this is the case, let me know and I'll take the time to write up the details.
For example, if your place is in VT, you are good to go. If your place is in upstate NY, you are not.
If this is the case, let me know and I'll take the time to write up the details.
Thanks Don, in this case I do not own the property but I am a rather frequent guest there - it's a bit of a drive through some anti-gun and some pro-gun states - obviously they are all subject to Form 5320.20 - at the very least! The idea is to enjoy the ample rural expanse the property offers but not be worried about filing and re-filing SBR paperwork that'd be required in order to remain 100% compliant with my existing items. It just seems easier to have something purpose built for this situation so as to remain within federal and local laws of the property's state. I am aware that the item being discussed here would not be legal to bring into CT. once fully assembled - I have no intention of doing that. I know we are wading pretty deep here but such is the case these days. We are all trying to remain within the law here so it's worth a peer discussion to keep it all legit. Thanks in advance.
dcmdon
NES Member
Good luck.
For what its worth. You don't have to actually own the place. The way one ATF inspector described it to me was that if you keep clothes and a toothbrush there, its a residence.
Don
For what its worth. You don't have to actually own the place. The way one ATF inspector described it to me was that if you keep clothes and a toothbrush there, its a residence.
Don
Yeah but you still gotta have some kind of docs that you have some residency tie there, enough that an FFL would be convinced of that.... I wonder if some states will issue a non driver ID to
accomplish this.... obviously you have to still supply some indicator of residency, but the bar might be different.
-Mike
JRT
NES Member
I still own a home in Vermont while I reside in Philly. When I want to buy a pistol in Vermont most stores ask for the tax bill on the home/property. I've had more than one only require a couple of utilities in my name. Maybe if I picked up a Vermont ID I could avoid the hassle of tracking down a bill in a paperless world. Truth is I almost never buy in Vermont, PA is so much less expensive.
I don't know CT law one tiny it but I saw something about a weight limit. These guys produce some very light AR Pistols, the lightest is around 4 pounds.
Balios Lite Gen 2 Pistols
I don't know CT law one tiny it but I saw something about a weight limit. These guys produce some very light AR Pistols, the lightest is around 4 pounds.
Balios Lite Gen 2 Pistols
dcmdon
NES Member
Most states have some kind of resident carry permit. That's all you need.
So if you have a place in NH, even though its constitutional carry now, its worth the $10 for the reciprocity it brings as well as how it eases the purchase of guns when residing in that state.
Does VT even have a carry permit??
The funny thing is that without a carry permit, every armed Vermonter or New Hampshirite within 1000 ft of a school is a felon.
Don't the feds require
Don't the feds require at least one photo ID though? I guess you could use a DL from one state and the res carry permit from NH, etc.
-Mike
dcmdon
NES Member
Yup.
Its even easier for a place like CT. Since their carry permit has a photo. So no secondary form of ID required.
If you want to know more just pull up form 4473 on line. Go to the instructions for question 18 on page 5. It gives all the requirements and criteria.
Its even easier for a place like CT. Since their carry permit has a photo. So no secondary form of ID required.
If you want to know more just pull up form 4473 on line. Go to the instructions for question 18 on page 5. It gives all the requirements and criteria.
