AR pistol with fixed Mag? (In mass )

jayhitek

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That stuff isn't actually that great but if it works for you then okay. Try some other stuff, specifically something with a heavier bullet. It might allow more pressure to build up before it leaves the barrel.
haha When I first read that he called AE556 tops.. I was like.. ummm.. really? I am not a fan of it at all. But maybe I'm wrong.
Glad to see that I'm not crazy.
 

djbradles

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haha When I first read that he called AE556 tops.. I was like.. ummm.. really? I am not a fan of it at all. But maybe I'm wrong.
Glad to see that I'm not crazy.
True at for least for high volume plinking it fits the bill. I am not a wiz when it comes to bullet ballistics. Now when it comes to target grade stuff I have never shot it in 5.56 or .223. I bought and built these models mainly for defense and cqc. I only have one AR that is good for target and I have yet to buy any good quality target ammo to try. Will have to branch out.
 
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Has anyone roll pinned a mag and if so where did you pin it ? would like some pics of the location. I have a virgin Anderson lower i'm pairing with a BCA 7.5" 5.56 upper. I have an MA lock to lock in a Pmag gen M3 but wanted to remove all doubt if its removable. I know CapeGunworks had video of their builds using the MA lock but I don't know if they pinned as well. No one on any of the Utube channels show anything like roll pinning to fix a mag so any help would be appreciated.
 

jayhitek

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Out of curiosity, If you're going to pin a 30 rnd mag to 10 rnds and make it permanent in the gun.. Why not just use a 10 round magazine? The 30 can get in the way of the table if you're bench shooting.
 

jayhitek

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Oh, so you don't want to pin the mag for a max of 10 rounds. You're looking to permanently fix the mag in the lower to make it "MA Compliant".
I believe they make special mag non-release buttons for that.
 
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Oh, so you don't want to pin the mag for a max of 10 rounds. You're looking to permanently fix the mag in the lower to make it "MA Compliant".
I believe they make special mag non-release buttons for that.
Correct. The language of the law is somewhat open to interpretation about what is considered "permanently fixed". Even the MA lock from Mean Arms can be removed with hand tools. I'm on a waiting list for a Dark storm industry lower but since I have a lower that I can dock around with, I thought I would go ahead and scratch build one for knowledge.
 

mlaboss

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Correct. The language of the law is somewhat open to interpretation about what is considered "permanently fixed". Even the MA lock from Mean Arms can be removed with hand tools. I'm on a waiting list for a Dark storm industry lower but since I have a lower that I can dock around with, I thought I would go ahead and scratch build one for knowledge.
All you have to ask yourself is, would a MA court consider your gun able to "accept a detachable magazine", since that's what the law actually says.

It doesn't say anything about "permanently fixed" or "only removable with tools" or any of that nonsense. The key word is "detachable".

What does "detachable" mean? Your guess is as good as mine, but my guess is that if you can remove the magazine from the gun without damaging or destroying the gun or the magazine, then it is "detachable".
 

amm5061

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Correct. The language of the law is somewhat open to interpretation about what is considered "permanently fixed". Even the MA lock from Mean Arms can be removed with hand tools. I'm on a waiting list for a Dark storm industry lower but since I have a lower that I can dock around with, I thought I would go ahead and scratch build one for knowledge.
So I can tell you how the DSI lowers work, since I have one.

There is a set screw inside of the trigger pocket. A hole is drilled inside the trigger pocket into the magwell, and the set screw fixes the magazine in the magwell. There is no milled out location for a mag catch to be installed. There may be other fixed locations, but that's the only one I could find when I examined my lower.

To remove the pmag from the lower, you would need to either forceably rip it out, or remove the trigger and hammer assemblies, get an impossibly tiny allen key in there, and slowly, 1/8th of a turn by 1/8th of a turn, disengage the set screw. It would be a bitch to remove, and without a mag catch, they can't just slap in a post ban 30 rounder. They'd have to drill it in the right spot to engage with the set screw or the thing would just slip out. I don't believe friction would hold it in.
 
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So I can tell you how the DSI lowers work, since I have one.

There is a set screw inside of the trigger pocket. A hole is drilled inside the trigger pocket into the magwell, and the set screw fixes the magazine in the magwell. There is no milled out location for a mag catch to be installed. There may be other fixed locations, but that's the only one I could find when I examined my lower.

To remove the pmag from the lower, you would need to either forceably rip it out, or remove the trigger and hammer assemblies, get an impossibly tiny allen key in there, and slowly, 1/8th of a turn by 1/8th of a turn, disengage the set screw. It would be a bitch to remove, and without a mag catch, they can't just slap in a post ban 30 rounder. They'd have to drill it in the right spot to engage with the set screw or the thing would just slip out. I don't believe friction would hold it in.
Thank you for the information and taking the time to share it. That's interesting, I assumed they just milled a mag into the lower while manufacturing.
 

jayhitek

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So I can tell you how the DSI lowers work, since I have one.

There is a set screw inside of the trigger pocket. A hole is drilled inside the trigger pocket into the magwell, and the set screw fixes the magazine in the magwell. There is no milled out location for a mag catch to be installed. There may be other fixed locations, but that's the only one I could find when I examined my lower.

To remove the pmag from the lower, you would need to either forceably rip it out, or remove the trigger and hammer assemblies, get an impossibly tiny allen key in there, and slowly, 1/8th of a turn by 1/8th of a turn, disengage the set screw. It would be a bitch to remove, and without a mag catch, they can't just slap in a post ban 30 rounder. They'd have to drill it in the right spot to engage with the set screw or the thing would just slip out. I don't believe friction would hold it in.
To be fair, this is how one manufacturer handled this by building a lower from the ground up with a fixed magwell in mind. Companies like JC Arms handles it a totally different way. That seems a lot less complicated.. Using an already manufactured lower like the OP has.
 

pupchow

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To be fair, this is how one manufacturer handled this by building a lower from the ground up with a fixed magwell in mind. Companies like JC Arms handles it a totally different way. That seems a lot less complicated.. Using an already manufactured lower like the OP has.
For a $100, they'll swap it for a standard lower. "What happens if I move out of state? - DSI will swap the fixed magazine lower for a standard DS-15 lower for the ORIGINAL owner for $100 fee."

And if you did decided to SBR the thing?
 

amm5061

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For a $100, they'll swap it for a standard lower. "What happens if I move out of state? - DSI will swap the fixed magazine lower for a standard DS-15 lower for the ORIGINAL owner for $100 fee."

And if you did decided to SBR the thing?
Why the hell would you SBR it? Just use a regular lower for an SBR.
 

pupchow

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Why the hell would you SBR it? Just use a regular lower for an SBR.
In my case, I put together a fixed mag 9mm pistol (AR w/Endomag) for a specific reason. After doing a bit of plinking with it, and repeatedly having to break it open to top off the mag, I'd rather SBR it.
 

jayhitek

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In my case, I put together a fixed mag 9mm pistol (AR w/Endomag) for a specific reason. After doing a bit of plinking with it, and repeatedly having to break it open to top off the mag, I'd rather SBR it.
I believe once you've registered it as a pistol you cannot make it into a rifle.
You can go the other way through and change a rifle into a pistol.
 

amm5061

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In my case, I put together a fixed mag 9mm pistol (AR w/Endomag) for a specific reason. After doing a bit of plinking with it, and repeatedly having to break it open to top off the mag, I'd rather SBR it.
Okay, I think I understand now. You mean unfix the mag, then SBR it. All you're gonna do SBRing a fixed mag gun is pay $200 to create a situation that could've been avoided with a pistol brace, so I was very confused.
 

amm5061

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I believe once you've registered it as a pistol you cannot make it into a rifle.
You can go the other way through and change a rifle into a pistol.
You got that backwards my friend. You can go from pistol to rifle back to pistol if you want, but you cannot go rifle to pistol. That becomes an SBR according to the ATF.
 

Mountain

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Correct. The language of the law is somewhat open to interpretation about what is considered "permanently fixed". Even the MA lock from Mean Arms can be removed with hand tools. I'm on a waiting list for a Dark storm industry lower but since I have a lower that I can dock around with, I thought I would go ahead and scratch build one for knowledge.
If you install the MA lock properly, you'd be covered for Mass.
 
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Hey y’all I’m wondering if anyone has looked into converting a fixed 10 round pmag to shoot from a 9mm upper? Also been a member for a little while this is my first post. Thanks in advance y’all!
 

Viper22

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Hey y’all I’m wondering if anyone has looked into converting a fixed 10 round pmag to shoot from a 9mm upper? Also been a member for a little while this is my first post. Thanks in advance y’all!
Are you looking to convert an existing fixed mag lower?

Or looking to use a standard lower and build it as a 9mm? Endomag makes a 9mm insert for use in a standard 5.56/.223 pmag.
 

Mountain

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Hey y’all I’m wondering if anyone has looked into converting a fixed 10 round pmag to shoot from a 9mm upper? Also been a member for a little while this is my first post. Thanks in advance y’all!
Are you looking to convert an existing fixed mag lower?

Or looking to use a standard lower and build it as a 9mm? Endomag makes a 9mm insert for use in a standard 5.56/.223 pmag.
Despite the ability to make a fixed mag 9mm, I don't think anyone makes a speed loader for 9mm. There's at least two different sources for 5.56/300 BLK loaders. Something to consider.
 
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Are you looking to convert an existing fixed mag lower?

Or looking to use a standard lower and build it as a 9mm? Endomag makes a 9mm insert for use in a standard 5.56/.223 pmag.
I already have the lower just seeing how many different cartridges I can get it to shoot using one lower. And I definitely see the point of no one makes a speed loader. I had not thought of that.
 

Mountain

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Now here's a thought...

A 10 round mag for .458 SOCOM looks like this-
It's basically a 30-round 5.56 mag but will only hold 10 in .458.
No speed loader for that either but 10 rounds is a lot of lead. I'd suggest the correct 458 socom follower which won't hold 5.56. You need to swap barrel+gas block and tube as well as the bolt. Everything else can be same including BCG and buffer tube. Easier to just swap dedicated upper of course, and not mandatory but recommended to have an enlarged port.
 
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Now here's a thought...

A 10 round mag for .458 SOCOM looks like this-
It's basically a 30-round 5.56 mag but will only hold 10 in .458.
No speed loader for that either but 10 rounds is a lot of lead. I'd suggest the correct 458 socom follower which won't hold 5.56. You need to swap barrel+gas block and tube as well as the bolt. Everything else can be same including BCG and buffer tube. Easier to just swap dedicated upper of course, and not mandatory but recommended to have an enlarged port.
So feasibly I could take out the internals from a 458 socom magazine trim in the spring put that inside of my fixed mag 10 round pmag and probably have a four round socom mag? As far as reload time goes not concerned it would be for range use. (Until I move out of state) Definitely food for thought.
 

Mountain

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So feasibly I could take out the internals from a 458 socom magazine trim in the spring put that inside of my fixed mag 10 round pmag and probably have a four round socom mag? As far as reload time goes not concerned it would be for range use. (Until I move out of state) Definitely food for thought.
Actually you can probably get 3 or 4 rounds in the standard 10 round mag. You don't actually need a .458 follower and I don't use them in my pre-ban mags. The reason I recommend a follower is to steer clear of potential legal hassles. The .458 follower centers the ammo and if you try to load 5.56 or 300 blk with that type of follower the rounds will be spit right out of the magazine. The centering follower can make a post ban 30-round mag only hold 10 rounds of .458. You could use a 30-round 5.56 mag converted to .458 only for making a 10 round fixed mag .458. Hope that explains it.
 

amm5061

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Sooooo want to build a .458
I've got one. It's too goddamn expensive to shoot often and ammo is tough to find.

I still love it, though. Kicks like a mule with a 16" barrel. A shorty would be tough to handle, especially in pistol form without a good stock to soak up the recoil.

Actually you can probably get 3 or 4 rounds in the standard 10 round mag. You don't actually need a .458 follower and I don't use them in my pre-ban mags. The reason I recommend a follower is to steer clear of potential legal hassles. The .458 follower centers the ammo and if you try to load 5.56 or 300 blk with that type of follower the rounds will be spit right out of the magazine. The centering follower can make a post ban 30-round mag only hold 10 rounds of .458. You could use a 30-round 5.56 mag converted to .458 only for making a 10 round fixed mag .458. Hope that explains it.
I can fit 4 rounds of .458 SOCOM in my MidwayUSA Stoner-brand 10-rounders without a dedicated follower.

Lancer mags and USGI are best if you want dedicated 10-round mags for big-bore calibers from what I've found. Tromix and Wilson Combat both sell dedicated ban-state modified Lancer mags if you want to be super lazy about it.
 
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