Applying for LTC-A in Andover, MA - Doctor's note?

[Len-2A Training]

They check your criminal background and mental history with mental institutes, etc....

Correct to a point.

The mental health check is with the MA Dept of Mental Health (or whatever name they now use). Their database "should" flag people committed to an institution under a court order. BUT that check won't find out about the person who voluntarily checks into an institution to help himself with a mental health problem.

 

[Sibb]

Hi All,
I'm new to the forums and I have been searching for the past 2 weeks,
and I have found a lot of good information of the site.
I live in Andover, MA (red town) and I am looking to apply
for an LTC-A.

While looking at the neccessary paperwork needed to apply for
my license in Andover it states that I need a letter from my
personal physician giving me a bill of good mental health.

I don't see how my personal physician would be able to professionally
diagnose my mental health.
I'm considering seeing a psychiatrist, as I would think it would make more
sense. Plus, I do not have a personal physician currently and it seems to me that
getting one to just sign a letter saying that I am mentally stable for an LTC seems a bit strange.

What do you guys think, and has anyone had to deal with this whole "Doctor's note"
situation?

Thanks-

Just move to Tewksbury, not have to deal with it.

 

[piman]

I did this process in North Andover about a year back. The PD here had an app package which included a sample letter. I've been here for some time and my doctor had no trouble signing off the note. Nice folks at the PD to deal with. Unrestricted if job demands it else try for that at renewal. Two references needed as well, no policy on who it needs to be IIRC.

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[GSG]

The mental health check is with the MA Dept of Mental Health (or whatever name they now use). Their database "should" flag people committed to an institution under a court order. BUT that check won't find out about the person who voluntarily checks into an institution to help himself with a mental health problem.

Then there's the VT shooter who passed two NICS checks despite being adjudicated mentally defective.

 

[Allman]

O and this will piss you off...when i spoke to the Andover Police when i got my LTC they told me, any Doc could sign it, a vet or a denist, a family friend whos a doc.....really????? they arent even serious about the medical note, its just to annoy would be gun owners...hmmm you would think smart people wouldnt want to piss us off...... its kinda like this haha http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIpLd0WQKCY

Wow, that's just incredible...
I'm in the process of checking to see if that Dr. is in my network, I'll let you know.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

There is a HUGE difference between an MD letter stating that you have been psychologically examined and determined fit to carry a firearm and an MD letter than simply states that the doctor is not aware of any medical or psychological issue that makes you unsuitable to carry a firearm. Any doc should be able to do the later, and it should (emphasis should) be just about as routine as getting a letter stating that you are medically fit for scuba lessons.

Be precise in what you request, and don't make it sound like you are asking for a specific testimonial; just a note there are no psychological issues in your medical file with the doc.

Or, you can hire an attorney at $300 or so an hour to file a court action that will result in an "impartial" district court hearing in a month or six .

 

[GSG]

There is a HUGE difference between an MD letter stating that you have been psychologically examined and determined fit to carry a firearm and an MD letter than simply states that the doctor is not aware of any medical or psychological issue that makes you unsuitable to carry a firearm.

In order to be a licensed armed security guard in Florida, you have to get a physician to sign off on something like that.

From the last page of the application:

http://www.doacs.state.fl.us/onestop/forms/16008.pdf

SECTION XIII. HEALTH CERTIFICATE

To be completed by examining physician or physician assistant currently licensed pursuant to Chapter 458, Chapter 459, or any similar law of another state or authorized to act as a licensed physician by a federal agency or department or by an advanced registered nurse practitioner currently licensed pursuant to Chapter 464. I certify that I have examined the applicant named herein and found no physical impairments that, to the best of my knowledge, would preclude this person from performing duties in an armed capacity.

I think something worded similarly to that would make leave everyone feeling warm and fuzzy enough for a Class A in such a city, without the Dr. having to stick his neck out for anyone.

 

[WayneWong]

In view of Martha Coakley's return to office, there is no way that these types of abuses are going to change short of Federal intervention. The people of Massachusetts have spoken. This is what they want.

I hope that GOAL stops drafting legislation that is destined to go nowhere. We literally need a federal case to put an end to this. Can you believe it? We are so far left here we need the Federal government to rescue us!

I have ramped up my teaching of LTC classes and there is another severe case of arbitrary and capricious behavior by a police chief. I am not at liberty to discuss it, but I assure you it is senseless and heartbreaking.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

I hope that GOAL stops drafting legislation that is destined to go nowhere. We literally need a federal case to put an end to this. Can you believe it? We are so far left here we need the Federal government to rescue us!

I share your concern with the "destined to go no where" legislation which we are encourage to support as if it's in play long after the real back room determination has been made that it is going nowhere. A huge problem with the reform bill (and no, the other side is not fooled by catchy names that appeal to gun people) is the all-inclusive nature, rather than taking territory a bit at a time. Come on - who really thinks there was ever any chance a bill that would grant machine gun licenses in MA on a "shall issue" basis was going to pass?

As to restrictions - sure, we'd like to see suitability go away - but it would be progress to get a bill passed that simply state that "need" shall not be used as a determining factor; only the suitability of the individual (similar to the CT system). While suitability is a problem, need is also an issue - as that is how very anti-carry jurisdictions justify giving LTC-A/unrestricted only to "special" people.

But yes, federal court action is needed - particularly in the post-Heller/McDonald world where MA has a boatload of precedent that is completely inconsistent with the findings of those SCOTUS cases.

 

[NJeane]

I'm joining the conversation a little late, but I'm having a problem similar to this one. I'm applying to get my LTC in Malden (a green town, thankfully). In the application, one of the questions asks if you've ever been a patient in a mental institution (I'm pretty sure all applications ask this, since there's a section in the MGL regarding this). The short story is I voluntarily entered an institution when I was 17 for help with depression. When I called the Malden PD and (without using my name) gave the woman the short story, she explained I could go to any physician and ask them for a note stating I was mentally stable enough to carry. It was a relief to know that I wouldn't have to track down a therapist I saw 10 years ago (or my physician at the time, who was getting on in years then).

I'm having a hard time with this since I don't go to the doctor on a regular basis. I don't want to say I'm only ever going to go to his physician once, just to get the letter. But at the same time, I haven't had a regular physical schedule since I was in high school. Any thoughts?

 

[DoubleDoeHoe]

I'm having a hard time with this since I don't go to the doctor on a regular basis. I don't want to say I'm only ever going to go to his physician once, just to get the letter. But at the same time, I haven't had a regular physical schedule since I was in high school. Any thoughts?

well if your required or face a tax penalty to have some kind of health care program why not use it even if it is for just this one time, find a Dr. have a physical done pay the co-pay (assuming you have healthcare and are employed not self employed) and ask him for the note. Although I would think maybe he has no idea if your "fit mentally" due to just meeting you. Tough call the fact that we (generally) abide by these constitutional right infringements daily and don't complain or move, makes me feel like we lost the fight for the right anyway....

jst my $0.02

 

[GSG]

In the application, one of the questions asks if you've ever been a patient in a mental institution (I'm pretty sure all applications ask this, since there's a section in the MGL regarding this).

The application says in part:

8. HAVE YOU EVER BEEN CONFINED TO ANY HOSPITAL OR INSTITUTION FOR MENTAL ILLNESS?

So I guess the question is, were you "confined," and was it for "mental illness"? More importantly for many, how does the licensing officer interpret that question?

 

[NJeane]

So I guess the question is, were you "confined," and was it for "mental illness"? More importantly for many, how does the licensing officer interpret that question?

I was confined in that I voluntarily submitted myself to confinement, and many people consider depression a mental illness - I considered it a momentary problem that has since been resolved. The thing that I hate most about this is the fact that this has never caused me problems in any part of my life until now. I did what I felt was necessary to preserve my sanity, and I feel almost like I'm being penalized for it.

 

[Squished]

I would interpret confined as you were forced to go, so therefore my answer on the sheet would be NO.

As with anyone who has applied for an LTC in MA, every department interprets every question differently.

 

[GSG]

I was confined in that I voluntarily submitted myself to confinement

I believe that the intent of that is to identify people who've been adjudicated mentally defective by a court and/or people who've been "section 12'ed" in Mass. (jargon for MGL 123-12). If you checked yourself in and were free to leave at any time, it's not really confined in my opinion. There's no case law in Mass. to clarify that subject in particular though, so this might be a situation where you want to consult with a lawyer to avoid the "lying on an LTC app" criminal charge & lifetime LTC disqualifier.

Some more info on this can be found in the below thread.

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...ntary-hospitalized-myself-do-i-screw-up-4473?

 

[gearjunky13]

Update i just applyed for a ltc class a in andover ma and the althouth the web site still states you need it the detective i had interview me toled me it wasent needed, the reason i had asked was because i never submitted the doctors note because the pistol permit pack i picked up never asked me to submit one, but i did get a note anyways and brought it with me to the interview and he told me it was not needed and he never took it

 

[yanici]

Update i just applyed for a ltc class a in andover ma and the althouth the web site still states you need it the detective i had interview me toled me it wasent needed, the reason i had asked was because i never submitted the doctors note because the pistol permit pack i picked up never asked me to submit one, but i did get a note anyways and brought it with me to the interview and he told me it was not needed and he never took it

Just to add more good news, I believe that Andover is now issuing LTC-A's with no restrictions.

 

[oniriggers]

Just to add more good news, I believe that Andover is now issuing LTC-A's with no restrictions.

Yea...I saw that in the mass law section....so I headed down to the station, talked to the staff, submitted the letter asking/reasons why I wanted my restrictions taken off, they said they would give me a call back....it's been about a month now and nothing? I tried calling the chiefs office n again no reply....I don't get it....

 

[Broc]

Yea...I saw that in the mass law section....so I headed down to the station, talked to the staff, submitted the letter asking/reasons why I wanted my restrictions taken off, they said they would give me a call back....it's been about a month now and nothing? I tried calling the chiefs office n again no reply....I don't get it....

If you want something done, you have to go there and talk to them. Dont call them.

I have called before and no one answered my call, so I drove to the station. Called one more time from the parking lot and no one answered, then I walked in and there were 4 cops + the licensing officer just hanging out, right next to the licensing officers desk. And this was a green town that issues no restriction (not that it has anything to do with laziness)

 

[gearjunky13]

Ya i asked at the interview if my licence was unrestricted and he did say yes, but its only been about two and a half weeks from then so i havent receved my licence to comferm that, the one thing i did that probibly has already ben talked about was in the wording of the( why you want a ltc ) qustion i put the usual, for all legal and lawful purposes and that i wanted it for personal protection. I had also made a note to go with it to exsplane why i warrent the need to have a gun for personal protection, like i hike in the trails alone neer ware i live and stuff, not that you should need a reason because of your rights as a citizen but it seems to help.

 

[oniriggers]

So talked to the chiefs office...good news, I'm unrestricted now...except they can't find my new card, they thought I had it already....so they are going to request another one....now I'm unrestricted in the "system" but not on my card in my wallet....can I carry as an unrestricted person? Or do I have to wait till my card says unrestricted?

 

[terraformer]

So talked to the chiefs office...good news, I'm unrestricted now...except they can't find my new card, they thought I had it already....so they are going to request another one....now I'm unrestricted in the "system" but not on my card in my wallet....can I carry as an unrestricted person? Or do I have to wait till my card says unrestricted?

Wait. Just wait. It's not worth the potential crap storm.

 

[boatman]

Andover is green. They are only giving full unrestricted now.

Don't make a big deal of it. Just get forms done. Letter from your pcp saying you are person in good standing is fine.


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[boatman]

Wait. They will get you a new one in a week or two.


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[Bill Katt]

Wait. Just wait. It's not worth the potential crap storm.

What terraformer said. ^

 

[oniriggers]

Wait. They will get you a new one in a week or two.


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Yes but wait till you get the new card hahaha

 

[Allman]

Andover is green. They are only giving full unrestricted now.

Don't make a big deal of it. Just get forms done. Letter from your pcp saying you are person in good standing is fine.


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Good to know, and it looks like you actually don't need a letter from a doctor anymore to apply.

 

[gearjunky13]

Its not needed as of this time, my friend just got his this year and it was not nessisary.

Last time i checked there web sight it still had not been updated