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Appleseed: Harvard, MA April 18-19, 2015

Discussion in 'Appleseed Rifle Training' started by hbennett, Mar 4, 2015.

  1. papijoe

    papijoe

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    Bringing a friend. If anyone is sighting in optics this weekend and has room for a couple more please let me know.
     
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  2. knfmn

    knfmn

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    I paid for an appleseed last year, but wasn't able to make it due to family issues. Does anyone know if I could get a credit toward this, or is the money gone?
     
  3. shiprec13

    shiprec13 NES Member

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    I'm not sure about your case since the event has already passed. I was registered for this event but due to a medical issue I have to postpone it. I emailed Appleseed and got a quick response. The email basically said I was ok to transfer my current registration to another event.
    Give it a shot (no pun intended)
     
  4. slap shot

    slap shot NES Member

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    I've only done one but I get it. Just saying that with the variability in the ammo and considering the distance of about 75 ft, using an AR is like standing 1 ft away from a dart board and trying to get bullseyes. Rimfire is much more of a challenge.
     
  5. LonelyMountainArms

    LonelyMountainArms

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    If they can learn to shoot Rifleman (a 210 on the AQT) in a day, sure.

    210. If you score EXACTLY 210, you get a special prize. I got mine...

    Seriously. Pay attention to that line in red. If you have ANY weak spot in your gear, shooting 500-1000 rounds in a weekend WILL find it.

    A few things I've learned...


    • Don't bring a brand-new rifle. Please. For the sake of sanity - both yours and the Shoot Boss's. it should be something you've put a lot of rounds through.
    • Leave the Remington 597s at home. I've yet to see one last a weekend without barfing it's extractor. (please don't get indignant with me; I'm not insulting you and your rifle (I don't even know you!); I'm just reporting what I've seen as a Shoot Boss.)
    • TEST YOUR AMMO WITH YOUR RIFLE. An Appleseed Shoot is NO time to find out that your rifle won't feed, say, Remington Thunderbolts if that's all you have with you. Run at least 100 rounds of whatever you plan on bringing through your rifle NOW; don't wait until next Friday night.
    • Same for magazines - get the new ones NOW and test them out this weekend. Number them so you can make a note of whatever ones start malfunctioning on you.
    • Bring your ammo in weather-proof boxes; if it rains on 4/18 and 4/19, you're still going to be shooting... and cardboard ammo boxes disintegrate in the rain. Ammo cans are GREAT for this.
    • Do NOT drop your magazines in the dirt - 10/22 mags, in particular, are susceptible to choking when you get dirt and mud in them.
    • Bring oil, a cleaning rod, and a boresnake with you - Harvard is dusty and dirty. You may well need to give your gun a quick cleaning.
    • If you're rocking a 10/22, make sure you have whatever you need to tighten the action screw. If your group sizes suddenly start going to hell in a handbasket, check that screw. They tend to loosen up. BTDT.
    • If you're putting on a new scope or Tech-Sights, USE LOC-TITE. Seriously. Or you might as well donate your spot to someone else. Your optics or sights WILL loosen up otherwise. See above re: group sizes going to hell. Use the blue, not the red.
    • If you need a loaner, ask the shoot bosses NOW.
    • Plan on cleaning your rifle Saturday night. Just because.

    Most important: Listen, learn and have fun!​

    OK, I'm off the soap box. Harvey, Matt - good luck with the shoot. PM me if you need another loaner; I can bring it down with me Sunday night. The range in Proctor is probably still under snow; that's why we didn't schedule one in VT for this weekend. :(
     
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  6. knfmn

    knfmn

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    Wow. Sent off an email asking if I could transfer my payment from last year to this new one. Got a response in about five minutes telling me how to do it. Nice! Apparently I'm finally going to do my first Appleseed on 4/18-4/19!
     
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  7. LonelyMountainArms

    LonelyMountainArms

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    Fred and the team are pretty good about stuff like that - we're not looking for a profit, we're looking to teach shooters and teach some American Heritage along the way.
     
  8. headednorth

    headednorth NES Member

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    @ LMA...

    I had to look that up for myself, but youre right. Where the hell did I come up with a goofy number like 221, lol. I shot a 222 my first time and thought I had just squeaked by.
     
  9. hbennett

    hbennett

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    It is not uncommon for an instructor to let the shooters Believe what they want to.. That..possibly might be due to a student asking an instructor who scored your AQT.."did I make it?"..and getting a response..Well, um, you still have room for improvement.. then the shooter proceedes to shoot into the 220 or 230 range...theoreticly ..of course...just to get them to improve even more...especially when said instructor KNOWS that said shooter is quite capable of doing so... Just say'in...
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2015
  10. aim

    aim

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    Well, the Appleseed distance is 82 feet. Maybe that's why a surprising number of 5.56 shooters fail to score the required 210 out of a possible 250 points on their first try, their first day, or even their first weekend.

    Admittedly, crappy ammo in a .22 does add to the challenge.
     
  11. hbennett

    hbennett

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    Shooters!.. There's only about one week left before the event.. if you're thinking about attending..stop thinking about it... and SIGN UP!

    To borrow from an instructor of mine from ... a while back.. "Replace fear and doubt with knowledge and understanding"....

    Appleseed is NOT a contest.. it is a teaching event.. be concerned not if you can shoot well enough to attend.. it is the instructors job to TEACH
    you to be BETTER.. no matter what your level.. beginners can make huge leaps.. and advanced shooters.. can work to get those extra points necessary
    to get over the goal line.. the Instructor's GOAL is to help YOU, the shooter, IMPROVE..whatever your level.. and we have a pretty good track record of
    making that happen.

    Appleseed is also meant to be a fun event.. and it is. Consider bringing family and friends for a memorable shared experience.

    Hope to see you on the firing line!
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2015
  12. hbennett

    hbennett

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    Hmm..once I learned and put the practice the techniques I learned at Appleseed..I was pleasantly surprised to see how much more accurate my center fire rifles became..AR included..
    all I had to do was adjust the "nut" behind the trigger.. The skill set also translates to longer ranges..we have proven that at the longer range at Leyden

    Learning on the .22 does have its advantages..one being less recoil makes it easier to concentrate on the technique..and not flinch..or anticipate the recoil or report..

    And yes, I agree, each rifle has its likes and dislikes ammo-wise.. I just swapped out a standard Ruger barrel on a 10/22 for a basic Green Mountan Bull barrel.. and the difference was night and day..it shoots better across a wider spectrum of ammo... but some ammo still shoots noticeably better than others..

    Keep in mind, the goal of Appleseed is to make any shooter a 4 MOA shooter with ball ammo and a rack-grade rifle. IMHO "crappy" .22 ammo simulates this nicely. The advantage is, with the techniques learned at AS..and upgraded equipment, the shooter can do MUCH better than that. 4 MOA is a baseline. Most CF rifles manufactured today, with decent ammo should easily be able to do a LOT better than that.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2015
  13. StikkerShokK

    StikkerShokK

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    Ah well, I guess I will try to remember this next spring. All I have is my grandfathers marlin 89 that I haven't shot in 30 years or a ruger I have just received and never shot. That 89dl was a tack driver, though.
     
  14. 4runner1443

    4runner1443 NES Member

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    I think there is another Appleseed at Havard at the end of August so you may not need to wait til Spring.
     
  15. exodious

    exodious

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    There is an Appleseed in Leyden, MA in July as well.
     
  16. slap shot

    slap shot NES Member

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    not following, 82ft with an AR you should pretty much have your holes touching. The .22 ammo, effect of wind, dirty rifle after 50 shots etc. make the .22 seem harder.

    I could be wrong as I only reenacted the aqt, didn't use the ar at the Appleseed, but I did try to follow it to the letter.
     
  17. aim

    aim

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    Sorry, entirely my bad. I was conflating a slight correction (the AS AQT is shot at 25 meters, not 25 yards, hence the 82' instead of your original 75') with an incorrect commentary on the state of American marksmanship.

    Statistically, few people score well on their first AQT. While the average rifle is capable of 1/2" groups at that distance, the average shooter often isn't, without instruction. Since Appleseed is meant to be an introductory marksmanship course (in addition to an overview of how a rather remarkable and unique political system became took its first step), this is really not surprising. It is also meant to be a positive statement about the people who invest actual time and money in acquiring this skill.

    I don't have enough experience to know how much an average bullet fired out of a .22 gets pushed around in 25 meters. I also don't know wether the average bullet fired out of a .223 has enough time to stabilize in 25 meters. Finally, I have never shot a .223, so I don't know if using one gives the shooter an unfair advantage. What I do know is that crappy, dirty ammo often results in enough stoppages to prevent some people from finishing the course of fire. Which, in a roundabout sort of way was the third point I was trying to make.
     
  18. exodious

    exodious

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    Appleseed began with .30 cal rifles, there is no "unfair advantage" to using a centerfire rifle. Remember, the marksmanship portion of Appleseed is not a competition, except perhaps with yourself.
     
  19. hbennett

    hbennett

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    Shooters! Your preparation period has ENDED! Time to sign up.. or show up.. There are still some spots left. This is looking to be a well attended event with a high probablilty that the event will be run concurrently on multiple ranges. The weather looks to be pretty good..and WARM..

    Be sure to bring plenty of fluids.. and a decent ground pad.. the cheap blue sleeping pads from the camping section of W**mart have worked well in the past.
    Hats and sunscreen would also be well advised.

    Rifle cleaned and lubricated?
    Got magazines?
    Got ammo?
    Ground pad?
    Eye and ear protection?
    Ready to improve and have fun?

    We look forward to seeing you on the firing line.
     
  20. StikkerShokK

    StikkerShokK

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    Have a great time this weekend, I will be prepared for the next one.
     
  21. Carabina44

    Carabina44

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    On my way!

    Sent from tapatalk pro using this Google machine.
     
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  22. papijoe

    papijoe

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    Well done folks! It was a great shoot!
     
  23. Carabina44

    Carabina44

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    Congratulations to all who attended the event and those that made rifleman. And special thanks to all the instructors for teaching us how to shoot like "Riflemen" and keeping everyone safe.

    Julio.

    Here we go!
    [video]https://youtu.be/o0aGthnPq1s[/video]
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2015
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  24. Jenny

    Jenny

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    rock. steady. NICE!
     
  25. Carabina44

    Carabina44

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    Thanks Jenny!
     
  26. Roy Rogers

    Roy Rogers NES Member

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    A hearty thank-you to enthusiastic Appleseed instructors including Henry, Matt, Jackie, André, Jeremy and Dan, and to the entire Appleseed crew. It was a pleasure to get together with a congenial contingent of shooters dedicated to honing their marksmanship, so many that it required spreading out across three action pits. Congratulations to the Boy Scouts of Stoneham Troop 513--19 Scouts and 8 dads--on fine shooting; big thanks to Jon Green at GOAL and to a number of additional people and clubs who provided ammo and loaner rifles. Thanks also to Harvard Sportsmen's Club for hosting. Of course, a two-day shoot over Patriots' Day weekend makes the proceedings especially meaningful. Looking forward to the next Appleseed.

    IMG_2794.jpg
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2015
  27. Roy Rogers

    Roy Rogers NES Member

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    Excellent video, Julio. Congratulations on earning your Rifleman patch.

    For those new to Project Appleseed, Julio's video shows the commemorative Nationwide Liberty Volley performed at every Appleseed shoot that falls on Patriot's Day weekend. Across the U.S., with synchronized watches and at precisely the same time, each Appleseed contingent stops what they are doing and fires a volley of 14 rounds in unison as the shoot boss reads out the names of 14 colonists who lost their lives in the initial round of hostilities that became the American Revolution.

    - - - Updated - - -

     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2015
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  28. hbennett

    hbennett

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    Julio, I'm sorry but I respectfully disagree.. We taught you how to shoot like RIFLEMEN! And it was an honor and a privilege to do so!

    Well done! You have demonstrated that you have the stuff that sets you apart. Wear that patch with pride.. you EARNED it!

    You are no longer a cook.

    RIFLEMAN!
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2015
  29. hbennett

    hbennett

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    My personal thanks goes out to the instructors mentioned, and especially to our young instructors, Ulysses and SamB, who set up and broke down the ranges, helped demonstrate, served as runners between ranges, worked the lines and kept the shooters safe, COOKED lunch.. and were indespensible in every capacity where they served and contributed..

    These instructors, all fine folks, VOLUNTEER for this, and actually spent tens if not hundreds of hour of their personal time EARNING the Red hat of an instructor..The only compensation they get is the satisfaction in meeting and helping fine Americans come to find the Rifleman within them. And believe me, that IS a reward.

    Appleseed couldn't happen without these folks.. and a finer group of people you would be hard-pressed to meet.. My hat is off to ALL of them.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2015
  30. Carabina44

    Carabina44

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    Thank you Mr Bennet you are correct sir. I will wear this patch with a great deal of humility and pride and pass the word. The privilege and honor is all on this side. Can't wait to see you all at the next event and bring new shooters.

    Sent from tapatalk pro using this Google machine.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2015

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