Anyone using the Redding Dual Ring Carbide Sizing Dies?

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I don't use one, last month when the .45 Colt die was on Midway's clearance list for the bargain price of ~$76 I read up on them. Problem is I couldn't figure out exactly what it was supposed to do. Other than increasing Redding's revenue I couldn't figure out exactly what other problem they solved exactly. That being the case if I'd bought it I wouldn't have been able to tell you if was working and if it was doing what I thought it should.

I don't know if Redding knows either, they don't really explain why anyone needs one.
http://redding-reloading.com/online-catalog/124-dual-ring-carbide-dies
Redding has solved the problem that has plagued ordinary carbide dies since their invention. The little ring in a standard carbide die had to do double duty. It sized the top of the case to properly hold the bullet but then continued to size the whole body of the case as well.

Unfortunately, these two areas need to be sized at different diameters, so carbide dies of the past have always been a compromise. Redding's solution to this problem is a unique (patent pending) design, incorporating two carbide rings within one sizing die. The upper ring is positioned to size only the bullet retention portion of the case while the other is located to properly size the case body without overworking the brass. Sized cases will not only look and function better but brass life will increase.

Huh? What Problem? My single ring carbide full length sizing die doesn't size the top of my case to hold a bullet. My full length sizing dies all size the case from top to bottom to SAMMI O.D. spec size, thats it. My neck size die is what sizes the top of the case to hold a bullet so how is it my full length sizing die is doing double duty again?

Redding says it won't over work the brass... OK and.... Still don't get it..... If a full length sizing die has dual rings to size brass, the brass is still going to get worked by each respective ring to whichever size the ring is. How is that different than a single ring full length size die? No matter if the full length sizer has one or two rings the brass is going to get worked again later anyway. The brass will get worked again by the neck sizer, then the seater, and finally the crimper. So again, what did we solve here exactly with two rings in a full length sizer?

A neck size is a neck size, a full length size is a full length size I don't care how fancy and expensive a die is.

What does maybe not resizing just part of a pistol case to a certain size accomplish then? I'm calling Snake Oil on this one, really expensive Snake oil at that. Further they only make them for straight walled pistol brass, why do we care? IT'S PISTOL BRASS!!
 
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Most full length pistol resizing dies reduce the diameter of the case to the point that it is slightly smaller than the diameter of the bullet near the case mouth. The idea is to support the bullet when it is seated. This is most easily observed when seating lead bullets which are slightly larger in diameter than jacketed for the same application. The end result is what appearts to be a "bulge" in the case just below the seated bullet. The reduced diameter just below the bulge is what supports the bullet. This is much more effective than just a taper crimp.

Using just one carbide ring means that, to achieve this reduced diameter for bullet support at the case mouth, the whole case must be sized to this diameter. Adding a second carbide ring would allow the die to size the case to a reduced diameter in its upper regions with one ring, but size the lower part of the case with a slightly larger ring. This would reduce the amount that the brass would be worked which might extend its usable life.

Sounds like a good idea, but I don't think it is necessary. Most of my brass splits at the case mouth anyway. I don't see how sizing the lower portion of the case will reduce wear and tear and increase case life. My big problem with 9mm cases is sizing the base and eliminating the "belt" that results from brass flow towards this area. I have yet to find a commercial die that will do this, including the EGW "Undersizing Die".
 

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Get a push-thru die and be done with it. No more belted cases.

Sent via tapatalk on the Yugo of droids.
 
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Reviving an old thread here. I'm expanding my recent move to reloading into .45 ACP. In 9x19 I replaced my Dillon dies with Redding Competition Pro Carbide and got improved results in a couple key areas. Now that I'm setting up for .45 I'm wondering if there's anything to the dual ring choice.
 
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Please forgive.

Redding tends to make better dies on average than the other companies. I've never heard of dual ring dies and since the .45 Colt is a straight wall cartridge at .480" diameter, fail to see how this idea works. Unless normal dies fail, which they must, to resize near the rim and that remains significantly larger than .480". Since I'm sure that .45 Colt chambers of necessity must be larger than .480" and those chamber dimensions are produced with an untapered tool, for this idea to work, it would have to mean that .45 Colt chambers are excessively large - ALL .45 Colt chambers. I don't know what you'd call worse than Brain Fart, but this must be one. Never mind that all things manufactured by man are subject to tolerancing and positional errors, never mind that the average reloader would screw this concept up though I fail to see how, no, just consider the bottom line of such a concept financially, to both Redding and reloaders. Why have I never heard of such problems with .45 Colt before? Or, given that sometimes I'm clueless in the extreme, did they produce such in every straight wall cartridge and somehow I missed it?

Most reloading equipment manufacturers screw up on a regular basis, witness RCBS in the early 80's. To date, the only company I've never had a problem with is Redding. I'll never buy, despite cost, any other brand than Redding and as I go along, have replaced most other brands. In my early days of reloading, when, in my uninformed state, RCBS was king, I sent back many dies. These were not due to minor causes. How about a 30-30 that came out of the die with no shoulder on one side? Or, in the case of Lyman, a .41 Magnum that came out of the sizer .010" out of round? Or a Lee die that was so crooked that the case wanted to fall over? I forget the caliber. I checked that one. It had .050" runout in a V-block. I've never replaced a Redding die. That a product such as this even made it to the marketplace???????

And since this response rant has gone on so long, I must question the concept of a push through die in .38 Super. The body is nominally .384" and the rim .406". I realize this was posited 11/2 years ago but wonder why no one questioned it. Or most likely another ignorance on my part?
 

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Reviving an old thread here. I'm expanding my recent move to reloading into .45 ACP. In 9x19 I replaced my Dillon dies with Redding Competition Pro Carbide and got improved results in a couple key areas. Now that I'm setting up for .45 I'm wondering if there's anything to the dual ring choice.

To me, they look like a solution in search of a problem, but I can see where something like that might reduce the "wasp-waist" appearance of reloads in some tapered "straight" cases like 9mm, or .30 Carbine. But the .45 ACP has hardly any taper at all.

What were the improved results you saw when you switched to them in 9mm?

Please forgive....

The guy in the post ahead of yours asked about them for .45 ACP, not .45 Colt.

As far as the push-through die goes, I'm sure he meant .38 Super Comp, which is a rimless version of the .38 Super.
 
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Reviving an old thread here. I'm expanding my recent move to reloading into .45 ACP. In 9x19 I replaced my Dillon dies with Redding Competition Pro Carbide and got improved results in a couple key areas. Now that I'm setting up for .45 I'm wondering if there's anything to the dual ring choice.

What are your improved results? I just run run of the mill dillon 9mm dies and I don't really have any issues, so I'm curious as to what you found was wrong?
 
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While loading 9mm the first problem with the Dillon dies was with seating polymer coated bullets. Whenever I took one apart I could see scuffing of the coating at the base of the bullet although t didn't seem to be an accuracy issue. After 750 rounds of that I got to trying Berrys plated 147 grain since heavy bullets is what all the cool kids I shoot IDPA with do. With the Berrys I noticed a slight impression on the top of the round nose bullet. I tried setting the Dillon seating die up for both round nose and for flat point, It was there to stay. I don't believe it was enough of a flaw to be a real issue with performance but I decided it was too soon to settle. The third thing I noticed was my cases had an eccentric looking shape (not sure how else to describe it). They didn't look like factory ammo.

I decided to try the Redding Competition Pro three die set mainly for the dial adjustable seater which is definitely awesome when you're experimenting with different bullets and OAL's. No more impressions on bullets. When taking apart any cartridge the soft bullets always look very clean no matter how un-straight I place the bullet on the case mouth before seating. The claim made by Redding about the design of this die better aligning the bullet with the case appears to be true. Lastly the final cartridge has a more uniform look using the Redding Dies.

My suspicion is that if I was using jacketed ammo of the mainstream variety like Barnes or Sierra this thread would have remained dead, however this reloading thing is much about getting the per shot cost way down. I've since reloaded two or three thousand Berrys plated and they've been accurate and trouble free.
 
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