I had a conversation with a dealer today and he informed me no Form 4s are being approved anymore because of the November 2017 letter to dealers outlining the changes to the EFA10 form and the barrel length requirement now being a required field on that site. Has anyone had a Form 1 approved since November of 2017? I have 2 Form 1s pending since January of 2018 and am hoping they are not denied.
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Any recent Approved 1 for MA residents?
- Thread starter Lxpony
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So, the ATF is refusing to issue the form-1 for an SBR because the state form won't handle an SBR?
That's bizarre, does the ATF try to use the FA10?
And... wouldn't an SBR be a "firearm" on the FA10, not a "rifle"? (since the barrel is less than 16 inches)
headednorth
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I was told by a dealer recently that SBR apps were not being approved in MA because of some letter that was sent to dealers regarding the shockwave shotgun being considered a pistol in MA and the same was coming down the pike for sbr's. Iirc he said apps that were received before sept of 17 would be processed but anything after wouldn't be.
headednorth
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Just passing along what I was told. I dont recall if he stated when the letter went out, but Im sure that according to him ATF isnt processing any apps received after Sept. TBH, Im filling out paperwork anyway figuring at the worst its just a bit of wasted time and the cost of a stamp.
headednorth
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Fwiw, I had heard that from one dealer and an acquaintance of his. Posted about it on another thread and was met by calls of bs. I dont know for certain one way or another. Im sending in a couple form 1's myself figuring it cant hurt to try. I had gone to the dealer to get a receipt for a pre healy receiver I had transferred through there a while back and had taken my time on sbr'ing it. He basically said "Ill give you the receipt but it aint going to do any good" and proceeded to explain why.
Here's the letter if anyone's curious:
steve8140
NES Member
So basically I read it as no SBS or SBR’s can go through a dealer unless it gets approved and onto the AG’s imaginary list which will never happen.
You could build one yourself after getting the stamp, convert an existing rifle or build out a lower but registering on the EFA-10 only gives the option handgun with a <16” barrel.
You could build one yourself after getting the stamp, convert an existing rifle or build out a lower but registering on the EFA-10 only gives the option handgun with a <16” barrel.
Heard the same thing i.e. you can build what you already have but they are holding up dealer transfers. More than likely this will take time for the ATF to resolve with the authorities in Mass.
Shameless poke: Establishment Clause
Shameless poke: Establishment Clause
headednorth
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Possibly a dumb question, but will they accept a form 1 that was printed off a pdf and filled out or does have to be a form actually from them. I had a couple of older forms from them which are different from the current one. Rather than order from them and have them mailed to me, Id like to print off a copy, fill it out and mail it. Is this doable?
headednorth
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thank you
headednorth
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If and when I finally make it out of here, anything gun related for the first year or so is going to result in me saying,"umm...thats it?" The endless hoops are getting to be beyond annoying.
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Double sided in duplicate mandatory.
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Winner winner chicken dinner. There is no concept of SBR in MGL. It's just a firearm which technically means it can be carried just like a handgun, subject to whatever restrictions are on your LTC.
Jconnor93
NES Member
Yes.
Mp5 clone. Form 1 trust.
Sent in Late June or early July, check cashed 18 July 17.
Approved 9 April 2018, received maybe a week and a half later.
Only thing extra I sent was my ltc.
I believe a guy has submitted a form 1 post notice of the Shockwave. I need to ask though.
Mp5 clone. Form 1 trust.
Sent in Late June or early July, check cashed 18 July 17.
Approved 9 April 2018, received maybe a week and a half later.
Only thing extra I sent was my ltc.
I believe a guy has submitted a form 1 post notice of the Shockwave. I need to ask though.
GLOCK-22
NES Member
The problem is this state is not going by the law they are reinterpretating every law to fit there needs.
Ma says SBR's are iligal so the ATF will only approve SBR's pre 7/20 because of this letter from Nov 2017
Mass ass hat's say that all guns with short barrels are firearms and all firearms have to be on the approved roster and must be tested for dealers selling SBR's and as personal builds it has to be before 7/20
But the problem with there reinterpretation is there only using half a paragraph of the law and not the whole paragraph
What there using
“Firearm”, a pistol, revolver or other weapon of any description, loaded or unloaded,
from which a shot or bullet can be discharged and of which the length of the barrel or
barrels is less than 16 inches or 18 inches in the case of a shotgun as originally
manufactured…
What it really is
'Firearm'', a pistol, revolver or other weapon of any description, loaded or unloaded, from which a shot or bullet can be discharged and of which the length of the barrel or barrels is less than 16 inches or 18 inches in the case of a shotgun as originally manufactured; provided, however, that the term firearm shall not include any weapon that is: (i) constructed in a shape that does not resemble a handgun, short-barreled rifle or short-barreled shotgun including, but not limited to, covert weapons that resemble key-chains, pens, cigarette-lighters or cigarette-packages; or (ii) not detectable as a weapon or potential weapon by x-ray machines commonly used at airports or walk- through metal detectors.
It clearly says in the law a firearm shall not include a short barreled rifle a short barreled shot-gun or an AOW
So a SBR or a SBS or an AOW would not be a firearm and would not need to be tested and be on the approved roster.
If you try to go on the the FA10 system and register a rifle with a barrel less than 16 inches it won't let you and if you try to register a pistol with a barrel longer than 15 inches it won't let you so there is no way to do a SBR any more with the state
I have left several messages for
Michaela Dunne, Manager of Law Enforcement & Justice Services at 617.660.4682
but no response I was going to call the bitch out for being so corrupt and stupid
Ma says SBR's are iligal so the ATF will only approve SBR's pre 7/20 because of this letter from Nov 2017
Mass ass hat's say that all guns with short barrels are firearms and all firearms have to be on the approved roster and must be tested for dealers selling SBR's and as personal builds it has to be before 7/20
But the problem with there reinterpretation is there only using half a paragraph of the law and not the whole paragraph
What there using
“Firearm”, a pistol, revolver or other weapon of any description, loaded or unloaded,
from which a shot or bullet can be discharged and of which the length of the barrel or
barrels is less than 16 inches or 18 inches in the case of a shotgun as originally
manufactured…
What it really is
'Firearm'', a pistol, revolver or other weapon of any description, loaded or unloaded, from which a shot or bullet can be discharged and of which the length of the barrel or barrels is less than 16 inches or 18 inches in the case of a shotgun as originally manufactured; provided, however, that the term firearm shall not include any weapon that is: (i) constructed in a shape that does not resemble a handgun, short-barreled rifle or short-barreled shotgun including, but not limited to, covert weapons that resemble key-chains, pens, cigarette-lighters or cigarette-packages; or (ii) not detectable as a weapon or potential weapon by x-ray machines commonly used at airports or walk- through metal detectors.
It clearly says in the law a firearm shall not include a short barreled rifle a short barreled shot-gun or an AOW
So a SBR or a SBS or an AOW would not be a firearm and would not need to be tested and be on the approved roster.
If you try to go on the the FA10 system and register a rifle with a barrel less than 16 inches it won't let you and if you try to register a pistol with a barrel longer than 15 inches it won't let you so there is no way to do a SBR any more with the state
I have left several messages for
Michaela Dunne, Manager of Law Enforcement & Justice Services at 617.660.4682
but no response I was going to call the bitch out for being so corrupt and stupid
steve8140
NES Member
Great post, there is another thread here where I was told to register my SBR’s as handguns. They could not cite any law or regulation past it’s less then a 16” barrel but they also would not give it to me in writing.
GLOCK-22
NES Member
I just had the DCJIS come out to my place and they told me there is no way to register it on the Ma FA10 system if you try to do a rifle under 16 inches it don't let you and if you do a pistol its falsifying records because its not a pistol so he basically said SBR are illegal in Mass and told me to get a hold of
Michaela Dunne, Manager of Law Enforcement & Justice Services at 617.660.4682 or
[email protected],
If I think the memo they sent out is wrong and I do think it is wrong so I left her messages and am waiting to hear back but I don't think I ever will.
Michaela Dunne, Manager of Law Enforcement & Justice Services at 617.660.4682 or
[email protected],
If I think the memo they sent out is wrong and I do think it is wrong so I left her messages and am waiting to hear back but I don't think I ever will.
CrackPot
NES Member
a strict reading of chp 140 sec 121 and a SBR has to be a "firearm" which is the same as a pistol/handgun since MA law does not distinguish. This is why they need to be on the list. It also means you register them as pistols. It is not falsifying records, but falling the law. Really curious who from DCJIS said it was falsifying records. The gun owner who works for them and does MIRCS training means well, but is actually frequently wrong about the law.
Try reading it like this:
'Firearm'', a pistol, revolver or other weapon of any description, loaded or unloaded, from which a shot or bullet can be discharged and of which the length of the barrel or barrels is less than 16 inches or 18 inches in the case of a shotgun as originally manufactured; provided, however, that the term firearm shall not include any weapon that is:
(i) constructed in a shape that does not resemble a handgun,
constructed in a shape that does not resemble a short-barreled rifle or
constructed in a shape that does not resemble a short-barreled shotgun;
and shall not include covert weapons that resemble key-chains, pens, cigarette-lighters or cigarette-packages;
or
(ii) not detectable as a weapon or potential weapon by x-ray machines commonly used at airports or walk- through metal detectors.
(i) is an entire clause that includes all those things as "not"
So, "firearm" *does* include everything that's *not* a rifle (16+ inch barrel) or shotgun (18+ inch barrel)
GLOCK-22
NES Member
But that's just it if its constructed in a shape that does not resemble a short-barreled rifle or
constructed in a shape that does not resemble a short-barreled shotgun;
But they do resemble a SBR and a SBS because they are SBR'S so there not firearms by there definitions.
I don't no I just dont see how there saying a SBR is a firearm not a rifle and how all firearms need to be on the approved roster its bull shit
The law was all good for 18 years then the AG and her minions reinterpret everything and now everything's illegal so all these years of dealers selling short-barreled rifles and dealers selling assault-style rifles rifles they were doing it all illegally and the prior Attorney Generals in the state didn't do anything about it
constructed in a shape that does not resemble a short-barreled shotgun;
But they do resemble a SBR and a SBS because they are SBR'S so there not firearms by there definitions.
I don't no I just dont see how there saying a SBR is a firearm not a rifle and how all firearms need to be on the approved roster its bull shit
The law was all good for 18 years then the AG and her minions reinterpret everything and now everything's illegal so all these years of dealers selling short-barreled rifles and dealers selling assault-style rifles rifles they were doing it all illegally and the prior Attorney Generals in the state didn't do anything about it
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