Any Forum Members Into Wildcatting

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Yours truly[smile] it was my first AR Barrel well actually my second, I bought a green MTN blank and practiced on that first, and it came out nice, the cut rifle blank was $390.00 I almost chickened out but my buddy who owns the lathe would not let me. I tell you between the blank, block tube and extension and engraving I am into this barrel for over $600.00, this thing better shoot I don't see why not but you never know.

Dean

PS: It is all the same blank for 556, 223, and Wylde it is reamer that you use that decides the chambering.
 
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A Cut Rifle barrel is 3 times as much as button rifle barrel, most people would not pay that but if you were into barrels and wildcatting and turning them you probably would be. I have several ARs but this is they only one that is getting that treatment, it will be a easy 600 yard gun when done which is not that common for an AR platform.

Dean
 

Michael J. Spangler

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So all of the extra cost comes in on the quality of the rifling? How are most ar barrels rifled? button? I know some people are doing EDM rifling now. not sure if that was just pistol barrels or what.
youtube time
 
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A Cut Rifle barrel is 3 times as much as button rifle barrel, most people would not pay that but if you were into barrels and wildcatting and turning them you probably would be. I have several ARs but this is they only one that is getting that treatment, it will be a easy 600 yard gun when done which is not that common for an AR platform.

Dean

Ok. I am comparing to my White Oak SDM bbl that I shoot out past 1,000 yards. Granted I don't shoot the x out at that distance but I am still working on my loads.

Can you explain the benefits of cut rifling over hammer forged or button rifling?
 
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Way to much typing for me so here you go.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rifling

Also the runout on this barrel is 1 thou, on a button rifle barrel it varies from 3 to 6 for a match one and 6 to 9 for a factory button rifle barrel.

Dean

PS I have no interest in shooting 1000 yards with a 223, it has over 30 feet of bullet drop and they energy of a Daisy Red Ryder by the time it gets there.
 
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Still more than a 9mm at 50y...


It is a good challenge and as a friends likes to remind me, I don't own a "real rifle" yet.
 
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So all of the extra cost comes in on the quality of the rifling? How are most ar barrels rifled? button? I know some people are doing EDM rifling now. not sure if that was just pistol barrels or what.
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They mostly all are button rifled, you have to go to a custom build to get a rifled one or a really high end builder to get one.

Dean
 
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Tim of flight is 1.7 to 1.8 seconds. It is a fun challenge, that's for sure. We shoot 9mm at 200y as well but the holdover isn't nearly as much.

I'm interested in seeing what accuracy you get at 600y as well as the bbl life. What are you going to squeeze through it?
 
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I am sure it will be accurate and barrel life should be better than a 556, since it is running lower pressures. It should be several thousand rounds it is after all 25" so I can easily set it back a few times when the time comes.
I am going to shoot mostly 69gr and 77gr Sierras and some 80 Bergers

Dean
 
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I have been pondering this for a while and have yet to see a down side, and that is what worries me what am I missing, so if anyone can see something please speak up.
I am constantly running out of 223AI brass it is long and tedious process as far as bolt guns go, not to mention wears the throat out on your barrel with all the fireforming. And shooters are always asking me for some, so in short it is a hot commodity.
So what I was thinking is taking one of my AR15 and Ackley Improving it, I would load it with regular rounds but I could go to the range and spit out a couple of hundred rounds in no time all fire formed, am I missing something or would it be that easy.

Dean
 

KMM696

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I can't think of a reason a 223AI AR wouldn't work either. I'd want a good brass catcher on it.

When it's time to set back the 223 Wylde barrel, how do you handle the gas tube? Shorten & rebend the gas block end?
 
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I can't think of a reason a 223AI AR wouldn't work either. I'd want a good brass catcher on it.

When it's time to set back the 223 Wylde barrel, how do you handle the gas tube? Shorten & rebend the gas block end?
You only remove 1/4" to 1/2" of the barrel, I am sure something can be figured out.

Dean
 

KMM696

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Why couldn't one just shorten the gas tube at they upper end, it is a nice straight section of tubing.

I don't have any pics I haven't shot the thing, let alone shot it out, I am going to find out more on thus subject.

Dean
I've been thinking about shortening the receiver end, seems like it would work. There is a slight taper where it goes into the gas key, right? As long as the protrusion length into the upper was matched I would think it should be fine. You could probably not taper it and let the key hammer the taper into the tube and it would still work.
 
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That sounds feasible, I am by no means an AR expert or pretend to be one, I know my Savages and Rems inside and out but that is they extent of it.

Dean
 

PatMcD

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I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but shortening AR barrels is not at all a simple task. I'd go as far as to say it is absolutely not worth the cost, given a good 20" AR barrel can be had for under $250. A great cut-rifled barrel can be found for well under $500.


The gas tube has a small hole for a split pin. You'd need to re-drill that every time you shortened it. That is going to be next to impossible.

Plus, there are reliability issues with shortening gas tubes. You will have to re-invent the wheel every time you do it.
 
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That is what I have into mine, the gas block, tube, extension and engraving is what brought it to over $600.00 mark.
I am going to try it and reset it, it was a $400.00 blank with 1 thou runout and will have 90% the work that has already been done to it being a finished barrel , I am not going to cry uncle that easy. I am sure someone out there has done it successfully.

Dean
 

KMM696

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Pat, I suspect your cost analysis left out the all important "buddy with a lathe" element. If this works, the only additional cost I see is the six pack for the buddy, and maybe an adjustable block.

As far as gas tube shortening affecting reliability, I'm confident that losing 1/2" of barrel and gas tube won't be a major issue. The dwell time wouldn't change on Dean's barrel - the distance from the gas port to the muzzle isn't changed. The slightly shorter gas tube would, I would think, slightly increase gas pressure at the carrier, since there is less volume in the gas tube to expand into. I'd think all within the capabilities of the JP adjustable block.
 

PatMcD

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I'm intrigued by this project. Never heard of it being done. I'll be tuning in to read updates.
 
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I did a separate thread for those AR15 AK47 guys who might not look at this thread since they might think it only has to do with bolt guns.

First In my never ending Obsession with Wildcatting and Barrel swapping, I have expanded my Horizons, so this is what I have been up to lately.
I converted my AR15 to an AK47, all it took was a barrel and bolt carrier swap,
and 5 min to do the change over, I must say I like the way it has opened up my ammo options and the groupings are half of what my Romanian AK47 is. Also Magazines are available so that is no Biggie.

Second this is where the Wildcatting comes in, I took a 300 Blackout 7 twist Barrel and reamed it out to 7.62 X 39 which is an AK47 Chambering, then I take steel case AK47 rounds and pull the bullets and dump the powder, and reload them up with my own powder load and heavy .308 caliber 30 cal bullets. IE: 220gr Sierra's and with that 7 twist barrel, and what you end up with is a subsonic AK47. Cool Beans.

Third just a few things I would like to go over, an AK47 barrel has a bore of .311
and a 30 cal has a bore of .308 I have seen AK ammo with bullet Dia of .308, .309, .310 and .311 I have shot all of them in this barrel and they all shot well and cycled fine with no pressure signs. I shoot .455 Dia bullets out of my .452 Casull and I am still here to talk about it, so here is the CYA part I have done it and it worked out for me your millage may vary, and I don't want to here that it is dangerous or what ever, Wildcatting is on they edge it is part of it's charm.

Dean
 
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Does it cycle reliably with the SS load? I'd be interested in having something like that over a 300blk because it negates the specialty ammo and brass.
 
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Does it cycle reliably with the SS load? I'd be interested in having something like that over a 300blk because it negates the specialty ammo and brass.
That is one one of the factors on why I went that route, 300 blackout brass is expensive to buy and a pain to make.
Plus the coolness factor.


Dean
 
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Does it cycle reliably with the SS load? I'd be interested in having something like that over a 300blk because it negates the specialty ammo and brass.
Actually, decent 300 Blackout brass can be easily made from 5.56 brass (or even commercial 223 brass). It can be bought, reformed, swaged and ready to prime and load cheap enough too.

But, to make it function, that can be fixed by running slower power, like is done with the M1 to shoot heavy cast bullets slow, but function.

I'll be at the Pumpkin shoot, ask me there. Same with 300 BO brass. I buy mine preformed, due to the fact that it is a major PITA to make (it isn't hard, just a PITA).

Oh, and I understand (but haven't seen myself) that 7.62x39 AR barrels (Colt at least) are .308 bore. Considering it's a lower pressure cartridge than the 223 the rifle was designed for, it works. But, if you want to shoot the heavier bullets, rechambering a 300 BO barrel is smarter, due to twist difference.

And, so everyone knows, even some good barrels are button rifled, like Hart. Some are cut rifled, like Krieger.

And, setting a barrel back and rechamberig to extend life doesn't give you a complete reset either. For an AR barrel, I'd probably replace it, rather than set it back. I'd also probably do the same on a bolt gun with a lot more invested in the barrel. And, I own a decent enough lathe and do my own work.

I didn't learn any of this by accident, but by doing it myself, and listening to good friends that KNEW what they were talking about.
 
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