Another respiratory virus from China (Coronavirus Megathread)

The5thDentist

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From today's Putin's Address To Nation:
Therefore, I declare next week to be an official non-work period while maintaining wages. In other words, the days off will last from Saturday March 28 to Sunday April 5.

Of course, all public infrastructure facilities, including medical facilities, pharmacies, stores, institutions responsible for banking and financial settlements, as well as transport, and ministries and agencies at all levels, will continue working.

As I said, the extended days off are being declared to reduce the speed of the virus spreading.

I am addressing all our citizens. Let us not rely on chance as we tend to do in Russia. Do not think, as we usually do, that this cannot happen to you. It can happen to anyone. And then we will very quickly see what is now happening in many western countries, in Europe and across the ocean, happen here in Russia. We must strictly comply with all the recommendations. We must protect ourselves, our families and friends, and we must adopt a more disciplined and responsible approach. Trust me: the best thing to do now is stay home.

In this regard, the following priority measures will be implemented.

First, all social protection benefits that our citizens are entitled to, should be renewed automatically over the next six months, with no additional certificates or visits to the authorities needed. For example, if a family is entitled to subsidised housing and utility payments, they will not need to regularly confirm their per capita income to continue receiving this state support.

Please note that all payments to war veterans and home-front workers timed to the 75th anniversary of the Great Victory, 75,000 and 50,000 rubles, respectively, should be made before the May holidays, earlier than usual, in April.

Second, it is essential to support families with children. In the next three months, starting in April, I propose paying all families that are eligible to maternity capital, an additional 5,000 rubles a month for each child up to three years of age.

This support is especially important for families with children who are not attending day-care nurseries or kindergartens, and for parents who are on sick leave or on maternity leave.

Regarding our new support package, I mean benefits for children aged 3 to 7, I now instruct the Government to expedite all organisational arrangements so that eligible families can start receiving these payments not in July, as planned, but a month earlier, in June. I also ask the governors to expedite the transfer of the necessary information from the regional civil registry offices to the tax service. Colleagues, it is fundamentally important to start making these payments. Pay attention to this.

Third, we need to support those on sick leave and people who have lost their jobs. Today, all sick leave payments are calculated based on employees’ period of work and salary. As a result, employees, primarily young people, can receive very low sick leave payments. This is, of course, not fair. I suggest the following provision: Sick leave payments should be calculated based on the amount of at least one minimum wage a month. This provision will be in force until the end of the year, and from there we will decide how to proceed depending on the situation.

Just like other countries’ economies, the Russian economy is experiencing substantial headwinds due to the effects of the epidemic. And, as I have already said, we need to support those who may lose their jobs.

Today, with the exception of some categories of individuals, maximum monthly unemployment benefit is 8,000 rubles. I suggest increasing it to the minimum wage amount or 12,130 rubles per month.

Fourth, loans taken out by individuals present another risk. Naturally, it is difficult if not downright impossible to completely repay debts when incomes are plunging.

I suggest declaring consumer loan and mortgage holidays. If a person faces a difficult situation, meaning their monthly income declined significantly, by over 30 percent, then they should have the right to temporarily stop debt servicing and reschedule it. It goes without saying that any penalties are out of the question.

I am asking the Bank of Russia to set up a similar loan rescheduling mechanism for self-employed people, too.

If people are unable to repay their debt for objective reasons, they should not be left without options and they should not fall hostage to creditors’ claims. We need a bankruptcy process that is fair and not burdensome. I am asking the Government and the parliament to expedite approval of the necessary regulatory changes.

Fifth. Small and medium-sized businesses and micro businesses, especially in the services sector, are now facing objective difficulties due to declining orders and revenue.

These businesses need help to stay open, which means retaining their employees. I would like to address all employers right now: once again, our most crucial task is to ensure stability in the labour market and to prevent a surge in unemployment.

Government assistance will be provided to businesses to deal with this problem.

I propose the following measures to support the enterprises and industries most affected by the current difficult situation.

I believe it is necessary to defer all taxes on small and medium-sized businesses, except for VAT, for the next six months. In addition, micro businesses should also be granted a deferral on their contributions to social insurance funds.

Bank loans held by struggling SMEs and micro businesses must also be deferred for the next six months.

Generally speaking, I am asking the Government and the Central Bank to propose and take additional action to ensure stable lending to the real economy, including through state guarantees and subsidies.

Next. Companies experiencing hardship must be protected from bankruptcy. In this connection, I am proposing a six-month moratorium on bankruptcy claims by creditors against companies and on the recovery of debts and penalties.

Once again, these measures will apply to companies operating in the sectors most affected by the current difficult situation. At the same time, I am instructing the Government to constantly monitor developments and, if necessary, expand and review the list of the industries requiring support.

Sixth. Right now, we must do everything we can to support the incomes of our citizens – especially those employed by small and medium-sized businesses.

In order for these businesses to get additional resources to support their employees, I am proposing to cut their insurance contributions in half, from 30 to 15 percent. This reduced rate will apply to any salary above minimum wage. For those making minimum wage or less for some reason, the rate will remain 30 percent.

Finally, there are two more measures I would like to suggest. Allow me to elaborate.

First, all interest and dividend income that flows from Russia and is transferred abroad into offshore jurisdictions must be taxed properly.

Today, two thirds of these funds, and basically we are talking here about incomes of specific individuals, are taxed at the rate of only 2 percent, thanks to so-called optimization strategies of all kinds. At the same time, people with modest salaries pay an income tax of 13 percent. This is unfair, to say the least.

For this reason, I suggest that those expatriating their income as dividends to foreign accounts should pay a 15 percent tax on these dividends. Of course, we will need to amend Russia’s double taxation treaties with some countries. I ask the Government to work this out. If our foreign partners do not accept our proposal, Russia will unilaterally withdraw from these treaties. We will begin with countries that attract substantial resources from Russia, which is a very sensitive issue for our country.

Second, many countries levy income tax on interest earned by individuals from their bank deposits and investments in securities, while Russia does not tax this income at all.

I propose that people with over 1 million rubles in bank deposits and debt securities pay a 13 percent tax on this income. I would like to reiterate that this is not about taxing the deposits themselves but only applying income tax to the interest individuals earn from these investments.


People of Russia,

All the measures that are about to be adopted or will be taken in the future will work and will produce results only if we are in it together and recognise the complexity of the current situation. We need the state, society and the people to work together, and we all have to do everything each and every one of us can do.

We have to be mindful that we bear personal responsibility for our close ones, for those who live near us, and who need our help and support. By and large, it is this sense of solidarity that underpins the resilience of our society, as well as an unwavering commitment to mutual assistance and the effectiveness of the response we come up with to overcome the challenge we are facing.

Thank you for your attention.
FB_IMG_1585200597410.jpg
 

calsdad

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as one who is now caring for patients with COVID-19, the directions of this thread have gone from amusing to terrifying. decisions made solely on fear are not wise decisions. despite the experts here on forum, this illness can absolutely destroy a healthy young person. We have managed to skirt a handful of folks along the edge of expiration but with all the resources at our hands. While it’s encouraging and provides hope, these resources WILL become saturated in very close time. From luxury of health and comfort, Try to understand the implications of this.

rash assumptions regarding therapeutics will achieve even more deaths. if a drug has 1% adverse rxn rate, and we give to a million people we Will cause 10k AR. Is that cool? To cause such issues we must know the benefit is justified, which is why we perform prospective NOT RETROSPECTIVE studies.

a drug must be put into a prospective randomized trial
RCT is not a luxury, it is a necessity
retrospective studies suggested here by all the NES experts are fundamentally flawed

When we employ any intervention, there is a concept called “number needed to harm” -look it up

this isn’t the first pandemic in history of mankind And it will not be the last. Panic is not an asterisk for get around methods. We are obligated to correctly work through this, whetheir it’s popular or not.

==

and those of you suggesting to get the economy back up and resume Normal life...here’s my Q for such geniuses: what is the acceptable # of deaths? So on lockdown Italy hit over 800 per day. It is not unreasonable to achieve 10 or 50x that without containment measures. Is that acceptable? I guarantee the same armchair Rambos demanding to resume economy would be wailing like a child when spouse or child dies from this.

for Those with strong convictions, let me make 1 suggestion: stick around for another 4 weeks and let’s see how things look.
Well that is really the question of the day - isn't it?

What is the "acceptable number of deaths"?

As a society - we've already demonstrated MULTIPLE TIMES OVER HUNDREDS OF YEARS - that death is "acceptable".

When Japs bombed Pearl Harbor - we entered WW2 , and the people in charge KNEW there was going to be death - a lot of it. In fact they had been maneuvering to get into that war even before Pearl Harbor - they just needed the excuse. The "death" thing really wasn't a major decision point - was it?

How many men did we lose in Vietnam? Something like 50,000 ? (going off the top of my head - feel free to correct me). Obviously death wasn't a major decision point stopping them from proceeding, because even with the country practically in revolt - it didn't stop the war.

Abortion: what's the death count there? I've seen figures in the millions. And the lefties are actually approving of full birth "abortion" now - so once again: obviously death isn't a major mitigating factor to making the decision.

Anybody remember that famous Madelaine Albright quote about how it was acceptable that there be Iraqi children starving to death as long as the political goals were met? Once again (I repeat ad nauseum) - death wasn't really a major sticking point - was it?

How many Germans, Japanese, Koreans, Vietnamese, Iraqis, Afghanis has the United States military killed during all the wars of the last 120 years or so? Again going by memory here - but I'm pretty sure the body count is in the double digit MILLIONS, so once again: death isn't really a mitigating factor in making political decisions - is it? And I've go further with this specific example and say spare me all the righteous indignation about "not caring" - because it's plainly phucking obvious that when it comes to "death" - we don't give two shits.

Notice anything about all of the above examples ? All of the people killed were either young (military age males) , very young (aborted babies), or "enemy" (all of the people killed in other countries during all of our wars).

What's one of the major distinctive factors of all the people who typically die from this cornholeya H1B virus? : They're either old - or they're compromised. I see a lot of news stories trying to point out that the young are dying too , but those seem like very carefully placed propoganda given how they "conveniently" show up directly after the "authorities" bitch and moan about how all the young people aren't paying attention.

So what are you trying to tell me - that old people and sick compromised people are worth more and are worth wrecking the economy and society for - but young virile males are not?

Sorry - but that's just stupid. The harsh truth is that young males are worth far more to the health of society than the old and sick are. So the current policies - taken in the larger context - just seem stupid - and even possibly suicidal over the longer term.

Look - I'm old (mid 50's) - and I don't really want to die by drowning in my own fluids. More than that - I have a young son that I REALLY need to stick around for because there isn't a lot of backup familial support if I end up dying. But........... if you kill my job and I go bankrupt and have to live in a box - or you pull apart all the threads of society and it all goes shitshow and we end up in war - either me or my son stand a pretty good chance of dying there too.

So now we've got the "pay me now or pay me later" factor to take into account as well.

Like JPK said: some of these policies just seem asinine - especially given that we could probably get most of the way there by just requiring that everybody wear masks - from what I'm seeing most people STILL aren't.

In previous pandemics - society pretty much kept functioning without a shutdown - and then moved on after the dead were buried. There is no precedent that I know of for this total shutdown. There WILL be repercussions from this - you can count on it. And in my opinion medical "professionals" are extremely myopic and are probably fundamentally unqualified to make decisions that affect things outside their small world.
 

ProGun

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A doc in NYC. Getting ugly there.

"Today was the worst day anyone has ever seen, but tomorrow will be worse. We are on the precipice of rationing. Needless to say, these decisions run counter to everything we stand for and are incredibly painful."
Meredith (@thisismeredith) on Twitter
 

NHCraigT

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drgrant

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Like JPK said: some of these policies just seem asinine - especially given that we could probably get most of the way there by just requiring that everybody wear masks - from what I'm seeing most people STILL aren't.
It doesn't help that a bunch of shitheads bought them all in like January or something and probably shipped them into china. [laugh] Even if the CDC told everyone in public to wear masks, there's no way even a quarter of the population could obtain them even if they wanted to.

-Mike
 

10thSFFD

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Sounds to me like the old Sears Appliances Insurance. It worked well when nothing was in need of fixing. Once something small needed to be replaced they shipped a brand new appliance, no questions asked. Fixing nobody knew anymore.
 

headednorth

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It doesn't help that a bunch of shitheads bought them all in like January or something and probably shipped them into china. [laugh] Even if the CDC told everyone in public to wear masks, there's no way even a quarter of the population could obtain them even if they wanted to.

-Mike
I saw that going on first hand back when the virus was a China thing. Also saw an Asian woman in Costco buying thermometers by the case.
 

NHCraigT

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Spain extends coronavirus lockdown, in 'war' to buy medical supplies

MADRID (Reuters) - Spain extended its coronavirus lockdown on Thursday to at least April 12 as Europe’s second-worst hit country fought “a real war” procuring medical supplies in an overheated Chinese market that officials said was rife with fraud and speculative deals.
The death toll rose by 655 overnight to 4,089. That was down from 738 deaths the previous day when Spain overtook China by the total number of deaths since the outbreak began. Health Minister Salvador Illa cautiously told parliament the data “make us think we are starting a stabilization phase”.

The number of coronavirus cases rose by 18% to 56,188, a slower pace than in the past few days, but health emergency chief Fernando Simon said that the start of mass testing for the virus would certainly boost new notifications of infections.

“We are in a real war to get hold of ventilators, facemasks and quick test kits,” government spokeswoman Maria Jesus Montero told Telecinco television.

“All the countries are fighting to secure domestic production, fighting to get supplies from China,” she said, adding that suppliers were failing to deliver on time. The government was also working to guarantee domestic production by converting some of the industry’s capacity.

Spain has ordered 432 million euros ($471.4 million) of masks, gloves and testing kits from China, and has turned to NATO partners for protective gear and ventilators.

A diplomatic source told Reuters prices had gone up ten-fold in some cases and Chinese firms were demanding payment upfront. A health authority source said there were queues of aircraft in some Chinese airports just to buy such supplies and middle-men often defrauded buyers.

Spanish officials did not identify any of the unscrupulous sellers by name, but said they were usually smaller, private firms, so Spain was seeking long-term deals with reputable companies.

arliament voted in the early hours of Thursday to extend emergency measures - including the lockdown that has seen people confined to their homes except for essential trips for food, medicine and work.

“It is not easy to extend the state of emergency,” Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez told parliament. “I am convinced the only efficient option against the virus is social isolation.”

Although the largest opposition party, the conservative People’s Party, supported the measure, its leader Pablo Casado chastised Sanchez for what he described as a late and inadequate response, particularly the government’s failure to provide medical professionals with vital equipment.

While Spain’s death toll is still well below Italy’s 7,503, it has been rising at a faster pace lately, having soared 10-fold since Spain declared the state of emergency on March 14.

In Madrid, Spain’s worst affected region, hearses continued to arrive at the city’s ice rink, which was converted into a makeshift morgue after authorities said existing facilities lacked resources.

Nursing homes, whose elderly residents are highly vulnerable to the disease, have been particularly hard hit.

An analysis by radio network Cadena Ser found at least 397 residents of such homes had died from coronavirus, nearly 10% of the country’s latest death toll. The health ministry did not immediately respond to a request for comment on the findings.

Carmen Flores, head of patient rights group Defensor del Paciente, said the number “appears correct”, urging the health ministry to provide its own data.

“Old people have been abandoned in an astonishing way,” she said.
 

Boris

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To all medical staff:

Europeans are now ironing surgical masks over moist thin cloth. If the surgical mask was used just for protection and does not have any fluids on it or dirt, they iron it.
they always did that, even ironing regular clothes not to f*** them up because electric irons often burst in flames. I even heard of condoms washed and reused.

There are some hospitals in Russia where they wash used bandages too, I don't think that I want that.


I think that cloth masks are probably better protection that rigid paper respirators because they don't conform to wearers face and suck dust from edges. Every time I use them, I can see specs of dust that landed on the inside.
 

new guy

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What the hell is the rationale for certain governors forbidding the use of chloroquine? They know better than actual doctors or something?
 

10thSFFD

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I saw that going on first hand back when the virus was a China thing. Also saw an Asian woman in Costco buying thermometers by the case.
Wait a minute! And I saw us hording ammo for ages! Please, let's not go that way!

In capitalism demand is good. Demand needs to be stimulated. BUT we do not have the real capitalism anymore! We canceled it by moving key manufacturing to China and Vietnam, and if we could, we would outsource it to penguins also. Back then we did not predict severe consequences. Duh!

We just buried all small businesses in America. We give them NOTHING! They can take loans or take a hike! Well done!

On Trump thread I kept warning you that donks call EVERYBODY with a job rich! Now you see it working just like in any other communist country. You and your wife, maybe even your kids were all busting balls, no vacations, making payments, paying overpriced insurances, ........Now you are RICH! And this is the first step. Next step is so called SHARING! We may jump to it soon. You will be asked to spread your wealth because "poor" masses smoked and drunk that $1,000 in about one week and now they need more and more but .gov can't continue milking small business which was buried without anybody's attention.

We should start exporting Socialism In A Week kit to the rest of the world!

After 9-11 Bush overreacted and got us a war which resulted in Taliban taking over Afghanistan and other countries. We called it MISSION ACCOMPLISHED, rest of the world calls it AMERICA F UP BIG TIME!

Now we are panicking and overreacting again. One day stupid politicians want us to eat in Chinatown and only few weeks later all restaurants are shut down. WTF? I want my money back! I paid for the best CIA and FBI in the world and what I got is $1,200 rebate!

Donks took over again and we are building communism on the backs of hard working people. We do not honor hard work! We honor prisoners, drug users, alcoholics, wife beaters, broken homes and welfare cheats. Let's make them happy!
 

number9

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In capitalism demand is good. Demand needs to be stimulated. BUT we do not have the real capitalism anymore! We canceled it by moving key manufacturing to China and Vietnam, and if we could, we would outsource it to penguins also. Back then we did not predict severe consequences. Duh!
Maybe I'm missing something, but there is nothing more capitalistic than moving production to a place cheaper than where it is now.
 

rep308

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To all medical staff:

Europeans are now ironing surgical masks over moist thin cloth. If the surgical mask was used just for protection and does not have any fluids on it or dirt, they iron it.
My mother is stitching covers for N95 masks that help protect them for re-use for my nurse daughter.
 

10thSFFD

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they always did that, even ironing regular clothes not to f*** them up because electric irons often burst in flames. I even heard of condoms washed and reused.

There are some hospitals in Russia where they wash used bandages too, I don't think that I want that.


I think that cloth masks are probably better protection that rigid paper respirators because they don't conform to wearers face and suck dust from edges. Every time I use them, I can see specs of dust that landed on the inside.
I also like cloth because we just wash them after every use in hot water. You do need to iron those also. Europe is waiting on new surgical masks which will be delivered in April. Those will use nano particles against viruses. I did not get one yet but it is coming.
 

Cowgirlup

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It doesn't help that a bunch of shitheads bought them all in like January or something and probably shipped them into china. [laugh] Even if the CDC told everyone in public to wear masks, there's no way even a quarter of the population could obtain them even if they wanted to.

-Mike
Still I bet a lot more people have them than are wearing them. The mixed messages will get people infected and killed.
In NH Sununu said wear them if you've got them. Then you have the "They don't work" or "Save them for the med staff" to "It's unpatriotic".
 

10thSFFD

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Maybe I'm missing something, but there is nothing more capitalistic than moving production to a place cheaper than where it is now.
And there, my friend, lies the difference between RUNNING the business and MAKING PROFIT. When you run business you have to always think about your customers. You need to make sure you cover situations for them they do not even know about. You do not want them to know about it because that is your service to them, you make troubles invisible and you offer solutions. Only idiot would train penguins how to make computers. We are those idiots! Capitalism is not ideal but it makes idiots to pay up eventually.

China is making TODAY 116 Million surgical masks daily! That is business. How many did we make today?
There is your answer!
 
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namedpipes

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It doesn't help that a bunch of shitheads bought them all in like January or something and probably shipped them into china. [laugh] Even if the CDC told everyone in public to wear masks, there's no way even a quarter of the population could obtain them even if they wanted to.

-Mike
That and it is illegal to wear a mask in public in some states. Virginia, for one.
 
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