My buddy signed up for NES and is waiting for approval. I did misquote him slightly, but the gist of it is they gave him a hard time about carrying and would not cover him. I will let him tell his story once he gets approved.
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Amica Insurance Is Anti Gun
- Thread starter Old Glory
- Start date
Response from my buddy: "you did misquote a little but they are absolutely anti gun... Corroborated by NRA research team. I will post I'm waiting for my account to be activated. Also, she absolutely asked me if I would consider not carrying my gun. They do cover people who own guns but they are still anti gun. From my friend who works for the NRA- "We've heard reports like that in past from various insurance companies. I'm going to pass along to our research team. Stay tuned!...Just got this from one of our researchers: Yes, Amica is known to be anti-gun and is unapologetic about it."
He will post but that was his response I cut and pasted from text messages
He will post but that was his response I cut and pasted from text messages
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OK, so this is a VERY different issue. This issue is about the umbrella liability coverage due to carrying a firearm. Please have your friend start a new thread about this in general discussion and post a link back in here. This is a very important thing that needs to be discussed. There are multiple people in the insurance industry here and would want to weigh in.
I have discussed this with an insurance industry guy who told me that generally, if you are cleared of criminal charges they will support you and the ins companies recognize and respect self defense. That said, NDs are not self defense so general liability is still an issue.
I have been with Amica for something like 30 years. They have never asked me if there is guns in the house - but then again, I have never mentioned it.
They didn't used to insure motorcycles when I tried 15+ years ago. Then when I bought a new bike about 3 years ago I asked them again - this time they said: sure we insure motorcycles. So they do tend to change their policies.
They didn't used to insure motorcycles when I tried 15+ years ago. Then when I bought a new bike about 3 years ago I asked them again - this time they said: sure we insure motorcycles. So they do tend to change their policies.
strangenh
NES Member
This really makes little sense. Insurance is based on actuarial tables, period. That is why they ask if people have swimming pools - major uptick in claims if present. But guns, really? Do they ask if you have power tools? A band saw?
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Important question. Are there any actuarial tables for gun carrying??? I don't think there are, or if there are, I doubt they are accurate given small amounts of data.
Maybe John Rosenthal gave them some actuarial tables that he created (pulled out of his ass . . . or was it his mouth, hard to tell the difference)!
![[thinking]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/010.gif "Thinking [thinking]")
I'm bringing this one back from the dead. I just had to fill out an online application for HO insurance from Amica. No word on whether they're anti or not, but they DO ask. Like Calsdad said, things change.
I had to retype my answer several times before I came up with something that didn't sound like "none of your ****ing business"
I had to retype my answer several times before I came up with something that didn't sound like "none of your ****ing business"
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I switched over to Amica a little over a year ago for my cars, boats, home and an umbrella policy. I have various riders for different high-value possessions and asked about firearm coverage. My agent said I had $1500 or $2500 with the base policy but could buy a rider for more coverage. She asked what I owned and I told her a pistol, rifle and shotgun which was the truth at the time. I have not, nor see the need, to disclose my additional firearm purchases since then since I am not interested in additional theft coverage. She didn't even stop or question anything regarding my firearms but then again I did not make an issue of it either.
Chris
Chris
Ok, I'm sure this will get labeled as an "out yourself" post, but let me just play devils advocate for a minute.
Most home owner insurance policies contain liability insurance. If someone has a pool, the odds of this liability insurance kicking in goes up slightly. If used properly, a pool is completely safe. Pools don't kill anyone, but because a certain percentage of home owners are careless, in the end it ends up costing the insurance company slightly more to insure pool owners (as a group) than non-pool owners. If I owned an insurance company, I think it should be my right to charge more (or even decline liability coverage) to pool owners. That said, I'm not aware that any insurance companies do charge more for liability coverage of such groups, but in theory I can see why they might.
In my opinion, the insurance company has a right to ask if there are guns in the home if (and only if) they are providing liability insurance (theft insurance is different, none of their business unless I want the firearms themselves covered for theft). As a gun (and pool) owner, does the idea of paying more for insurance sound good to me? Of course not. But if I want someone to insure me against liability, I think they have the right to evaluate their risk before providing such coverage. I may argue their risk is no greater because I'm a responsible pool and gun owner, but they of course have no way of determining who the responsible home owners are, and have to classify risk based on limited facts.
Ok, I'm ducking now. Let the tomatoes fly...
Most home owner insurance policies contain liability insurance. If someone has a pool, the odds of this liability insurance kicking in goes up slightly. If used properly, a pool is completely safe. Pools don't kill anyone, but because a certain percentage of home owners are careless, in the end it ends up costing the insurance company slightly more to insure pool owners (as a group) than non-pool owners. If I owned an insurance company, I think it should be my right to charge more (or even decline liability coverage) to pool owners. That said, I'm not aware that any insurance companies do charge more for liability coverage of such groups, but in theory I can see why they might.
In my opinion, the insurance company has a right to ask if there are guns in the home if (and only if) they are providing liability insurance (theft insurance is different, none of their business unless I want the firearms themselves covered for theft). As a gun (and pool) owner, does the idea of paying more for insurance sound good to me? Of course not. But if I want someone to insure me against liability, I think they have the right to evaluate their risk before providing such coverage. I may argue their risk is no greater because I'm a responsible pool and gun owner, but they of course have no way of determining who the responsible home owners are, and have to classify risk based on limited facts.
Ok, I'm ducking now. Let the tomatoes fly...
I own an Insurance agency in Boston and i've never heard of an insurance company denying coverage based on firearms ownership. I dont sell Amica, but i find it hard to believe they would have a problem with it.
bigtig50
NES Member
Do they ask any questions about HARD BLOCKS ?
![[rofl]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/013.gif "ROFL [rofl]")
I am truly sorry, but I just cannot seem to get that outta my head!
Presumably the increased personal safety and reduced risk that attend firearms ownership should earn the policyholder a premium discount.
Yes, HARD BLOCKS and Pitbulls.
Do they ask any questions about HARD BLOCKS ?
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Homeowners and liability policies do not pay the policy holder for their own personal injury, therefore, you would be asking for a discount based in the reduction in a risk not related to the policy payouts.
Insurance company agents are not always bright bulbs. I had one ask if a West Highland White Terrier was another term for Pit Bull.
I'm bringing this one back from the dead. I just had to fill out an online application for HO insurance from Amica. No word on whether they're anti or not, but they DO ask. Like Calsdad said, things change.
I had to retype my answer several times before I came up with something that didn't sound like "none of your ****ing business"
Sigh. They ask because guns are like jewlery; expensive and something thieves like to steal. They're basing your premium in part on that. That and you've got a liability exposure a non gun owner doesn't have - you MAY accidentally shoot someone. It doesn't mean you WILL just that the potential exists and insurance is all about potential risk. That's it. Nothing sinister here folks.
Good grief, an 18 pg PDF questionnaire just to get insurance!!
That would be a turn-off to me to begin with . . . and people complain about LTC/PP applications that exceed 1 page!
That would be a turn-off to me to begin with . . . and people complain about LTC/PP applications that exceed 1 page!
1903Collector
NES Member
Think that's bad, we got denied homeowners from one company because of our credit score of all things....only thing was our scores were great according to Equifax and trans union. They are a nessesary evil but inusrance companies are a bunch of effin whores!
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This may simply be a questionnaire used as data inputs for their underwriters. It may have nothing to do with your coverage but if there is ever a claim the underwriter will look at the form and use the answers to correlate the nature of the claim to the answers and try to figure out how to price future premiums for everyone via modifying the actuarial tables used to build premiums. I am not seeing the problem here. If I was an underwriter and hearing from the Brady campaign that a gun in the household increases your risk of death by 2.5x I would want to know more (i.e.; was it BS, is there something too this, etc) too.
This was not my experience. I am an Amica homeowner and auto policyholder. They did ask for a list of guns and information about how they were stored but other than providing that info there were no issues. Given that the homeowner policy does have some component of liability coverage I thought it was a fair request and complied.
