Air Force lays out specs for its next handgun

[Pilgrim]

http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2007/04/airforce_handgun_request_070419w/

Air Force lays out specs for its next handgun

By Seamus O’Connor - Staff writer
Posted : Monday Apr 23, 2007 12:41:24 EDT

The Air Force is asking gun makers for their input on the design of the next handgun for airmen.
The service issued a memo Monday laying out its demands. The service wants a weapon with a baseline caliber of .45, though gun is required to be reconfigurable for multiple bullet sizes. The ideal weapon would have a service life exceeding 25,000 rounds and has a grip that can be tailored for any user, according to the memo.
In addition, the memo set out specifications for an accompanying silencer. The device must be able to reduce discharge noise to 140 decibels at least, weigh no more than 10 ounces and have a service life of 3,000 to 10,000 rounds.
The required monthly production rate is 7,500 handguns, starting six months after the forthcoming contract is awarded, the document said.
The information brought in by the memo will be used to create a request for proposals at a yet unannounced time.
Gen. T. Michael Moseley, Air Force chief of staff, first introduced the idea of new Air Force handguns at a House Appropriations Committee hearing in February. An unspecified portion of the $7 billion Air Force supplemental budget request is set aside for handgun acquisition.


no more than 10 oz in a .45?????????

 

[Admin]

have a service life of 3,000 to 10,000 rounds.

This is even more absurd than the weight...

 

[drgrant]

http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2007/04/airforce_handgun_request_070419w/

Air Force lays out specs for its next handgun

By Seamus O’Connor - Staff writer
Posted : Monday Apr 23, 2007 12:41:24 EDT

The Air Force is asking gun makers for their input on the design of the next handgun for airmen.
The service issued a memo Monday laying out its demands. The service wants a weapon with a baseline caliber of .45, though gun is required to be reconfigurable for multiple bullet sizes. The ideal weapon would have a service life exceeding 25,000 rounds and has a grip that can be tailored for any user, according to the memo.
In addition, the memo set out specifications for an accompanying silencer. The device must be able to reduce discharge noise to 140 decibels at least, weigh no more than 10 ounces and have a service life of 3,000 to 10,000 rounds.
The required monthly production rate is 7,500 handguns, starting six months after the forthcoming contract is awarded, the document said.
The information brought in by the memo will be used to create a request for proposals at a yet unannounced time.
Gen. T. Michael Moseley, Air Force chief of staff, first introduced the idea of new Air Force handguns at a House Appropriations Committee hearing in February. An unspecified portion of the $7 billion Air Force supplemental budget request is set aside for handgun acquisition.


no more than 10 oz in a .45?????????

I can see it now.

BANG! OW!
BANG! OW!

Thats pretty insane, considering that those little scandium featherweight
pain dispensing revolvers don't even weigh that little.

-Mike

 

[Adam_MA]

no more than 10 oz in a .45?????????

I think that weight was refering to the weight of the actual silencer.

In addition, the memo set out specifications for an accompanying silencer. The device must be able to reduce discharge noise to 140 decibels at least, weigh no more than 10 ounces and have a service life of 3,000 to 10,000 rounds.

 

[EddieCoyle]

I can see it now.

BANG! OW!
BANG! OW!

Thats pretty insane, considering that those little scandium featherweight
pain dispensing revolvers don't even weigh that little.

-Mike

Um, Mike...the silencer has to weigh 10 ounces - not the gun.

Expecting 3000-10,000 rounds out of a silencer would be asking a lot, but they only need the decibel level reduced to 140dB, which is still very loud (a power saw is about 110dB). Such a silencer could be made to last that long.

 

[Pilgrim]

I think that weight was refering to the weight of the actual silencer.

After rereading it, I think you're right.

 

[Mikey]

I would put my money on the M&P, Maybe I am crazy but I think the M&P was always going to be the next gun for the armed forces and this memo from the Air Force is just a formality.

But like I said maybe I am crazy. What do you guys think will be chosen?

 

[Scrivener]

I'll bite - why would the Air Force need a silencer?

 

[Admin]

I'll bite - why would the Air Force need a silencer?

They run a lot of covert ops in country.

 

[Adam_MA]

I'm sure if a pilot was shot down, and they had to use their pistol they wouldn't want to announce their position.

 

[kevin9]

I'll bite - why would the Air Force need a silencer?

Because they don't want to disturb their pilots' beauty rest.

 

[Admin]

I'm sure if a pilot was shot down, and they had to use their pistol they wouldn't want to announce their position.

From what my uncle told me they typically use their own personal weapon in the cockpit.

 

[drgrant]

Um, Mike...the silencer has to weigh 10 ounces - not the gun.

Expecting 3000-10,000 rounds out of a silencer would be asking a lot, but they only need the decibel level reduced to 140dB, which is still very loud (a power saw is about 110dB). Such a silencer could be made to last that long.

I figured that out after actually reading the article correctly.


-Mike

 

[Thor67]

They run a lot of covert ops in country.

Their combat control teams, and PJs certainly do.

 

[Adam_MA]

My father carried a squad issued weapon. A S&W 38 revolver from what I remember. That was a long time ago though.

 

[Admin]

Their combat control teams, and PJs certainly do.

Last time I checked I didn't recall seeing the combat controllers and PJ's any where near 7500 bodies...

The required monthly production rate is 7,500 handguns,

 

[Thor67]

Better to have it as part of the specs and not need it I'm sure.

 

[Admin]

Better to have it as part of the specs and not need it I'm sure.

Those units usually procure their own T.O. weapons.

 

[Ripach]

C'mon it's the Air Farce they are not actualy planing on shooting anything.

 

[Scrivener]

I'm sure if a pilot was shot down, and they had to use their pistol they wouldn't want to announce their position.

Yeah, 140dB is barely a whisper.......

 

[TimJ]

I'll bite - why would the Air Force need a silencer?

For signalling behind enemy lines?

 

[Cross-X]

C'mon it's the Air Farce they are not actualy planing on shooting anything.

Shoot, I thought we were all on the same team.

 

[N.E. CHARTERS]

RADAR

While going to Skool for the Gumint a couple of years ago; Two of the guys in my class had been called active to go to Afganastan to work as RADAR control, TACAN.

They were issued the standard M-16 with 180 rounds of 5.56 mm ammo. Not much firepower.

I think I would want to carry my own .45 as a backup. Not the piece of crap .45 that I used to carry in the Navy.

Of course I would need a Bwanna to carry my ammo. That stuff is heavy.


Or better Yet a Carbon!

 

[noelephant]

Why do you suppose the airforce needs to spend all kinds of money having a .45 developed custom for them?

From the looks of things there are a LOT of .45's out there already to choose from.

 

[Coyote33]

Why do you suppose the airforce needs to spend all kinds of money having a .45 developed custom for them?

From the looks of things there are a LOT of .45's out there already to choose from.

Yeah. You'd think they would have been in on the joint effort (though that has ended now).

 

[Jose]

From the people who brought you $600 toilet seats.

 

[firtree]

Yeah. You'd think they would have been in on the joint effort (though that has ended now).

But even a joint effort is often a huge waste of time and money. There are
several high quality, highly reliable .45s on the market. Check them all out,
test them head to head, get quotes, buy a large lot.

Or...we could spend a fortune getting custom samples from the manufacturers
because the AF needed their new .45 to have 4 threads instead of the standard
6 (or whatever) on the barrel.

What happened to the late 90s / early 2000s push for COTS (commercial off the
shelf) that was all the rage when I worked in defense?

 

[adweisbe]

COTS? That just means paying someone to develop a COTS item and then sell it to you. You won't find most COTS stuff on a shelf anywhere.

 

[vellnueve]

At least they have recognized the superiority of the .45 where the Army has not.

 

[Ripach]

Shoot, I thought we were all on the same team.

Aw C'mon, the defensive line isn't allowed to have a little fun at the punter's expense?

Honestly it's just jealousy, when I was in the army our "Air Force Liaison" used to get hardship pay because our facilities weren't up to AF standards. Ever since I never pass up the chance to get a laugh at their expense.