1. If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership  The benefits pay for the membership many times over.

  2. Dismiss Notice

How do I ID a WW II Japanese Rifle

Discussion in 'Mil Surp Collectors' started by ramx50, Sep 11, 2009.

  1. ramx50

    ramx50 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2006
    Messages:
    417
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    Wakefield, MA
    I just got a Rifle from my grandfathers collection. My father told me that my grandfather got it off a Japanese soilder in the south pacific during WWII. The rifle has Japanese markings on it and also has a ground off spot that I was told is where the setting sun was but was ground off on all captured Jap rifles.

    I am not sure where to look for markings or what markings are important.
    Any help to ID this rifle would be great as I know nothing about WWII Jap rifles!

    I will post photos as soon as I can
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2009
  2. m44

    m44 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2008
    Messages:
    1,088
    Likes Received:
    22
    Location:
    Holland,Mass
    Post some pictures of the markings on the side of the receiver so we can tell you the model, series and arsenal. do you know what caliber it is in, beware jap rifles are addicting.
     
  3. darrowj

    darrowj NES Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2009
    Messages:
    458
    Likes Received:
    26
    Location:
    Worcester County MA
    I'm at the edge of my understand about this subject but will take a second to answer because in the spring this year I visited Gartman Arms Co in Wrentham.

    Anyway, I was looking for an old milsurp rifle and an older gentlemen (Benko I'm told is his name) showed me around. He brought me some old WW2 rifles he said were from Japan. One thing I remember him pointing out was that before U.S. soldiers could bring them home as war trophies they had to remove the rising sun symbol from them. He pointed out one with the rising sun symbol still visible and said they were very rare in that condition. Normally that symbol was ground off he said. Sounds like your fathers. If I remember correctly the rising sun symbol was right near the bolt lever and centered when the bolt was down.

    Not much to go on but my 2 cents on the subject. That gun shop was amazing and the owner was very knowledgable.
     
  4. JonJ

    JonJ Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2005
    Messages:
    13,069
    Likes Received:
    335
    Location:
    Plymouth, MA
  5. LoginName

    LoginName NES Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2006
    Messages:
    14,730
    Likes Received:
    2,661


    Actually it was the chrysanthemum stamping (symbol of the Emperor), that were ground off.

    http://www.gunboards.com/sites/banzai/FeatArts/MumMystery/MissingMum.htm
     
  6. terraformer

    terraformer NES Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2008
    Messages:
    16,653
    Likes Received:
    1,847
    FYI: Ground off mums (as in chrysanthemums and not setting suns) usually indicated that the rifle was captured as part of the general surrender and not a battlefield prize. The Japanese to save face ground the mum down as surrender became imminent. These were processed and distributed as souvenirs to GIs while the rifles individual soldiers took as battlefield prizes will usually have the mum (since the guy holding it likely didn't have time to ground it down before succumbing to his wounds...[wink]).
     
  7. USMA-82

    USMA-82 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2005
    Messages:
    3,367
    Likes Received:
    257
    Location:
    Between 290, 495 & the Mass Pike
    There are quite a few models of Jap rifles that were used between WWI and WWII. Pictures will definitely be a big help here.

    Yeah, the 'mum (chrysanthemum) was ground off surrendered weapons at the end of the war because it represented the emperor. The examples found today with the 'mum are usually ones that were "battle-captured" during the war. There was no opportunity to deface the symbol.

    This is one of the best sources of information on Jap rifles. You can probably find it cheaper if you look around, or buy used from Amazon:

    http://www.ajarmsbooksellers.com/cgi-bin/ajarms/1247

    And when you finally identify which model you have, check out the market value here:

    http://www.fo.com/cr-buds/prices.asp

    Good luck, and post those pics soon!
     
  8. ramx50

    ramx50 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2006
    Messages:
    417
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    Wakefield, MA
    Ok here are some photos I took. The only numbers I found on the receiver are 66069 but their are two symbols, one before and one after the numbers.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2009
  9. JonJ

    JonJ Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2005
    Messages:
    13,069
    Likes Received:
    335
    Location:
    Plymouth, MA
    Did you check the links I posted? You'll be able to ID the rifle and decipher the symbols.
     
  10. Madmarek

    Madmarek Member

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2008
    Messages:
    592
    Likes Received:
    48
    Location:
    Mass
    When I was in Barnes and Noble last week checking out the magazines there was a military surplus rifle type magazine and they had an article on Japanese rifles. Might want to kill 15 minutes there and see if its worth buying the magazine.
     
  11. ramx50

    ramx50 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2006
    Messages:
    417
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    Wakefield, MA
    Yes I did THANKS!

    The symbol at the end of the numbers indicates it was made by Nagoya Arsenal 1923-1945

    I am still trying to figure out what the symbol is that is before the numbers
     
  12. USMA-82

    USMA-82 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2005
    Messages:
    3,367
    Likes Received:
    257
    Location:
    Between 290, 495 & the Mass Pike
    I'd love to help you out with the markings, but you're going to need to provide a clearer picture.

    Decent Jap 99, early production (not "last-ditch), but missing the monopod and "airplane wings" on the rear sight.

    Not likely someone "got it off a Japanese soldier" if the mum is ground. A complete mum usually implies a battlefield capture, because soldiers weren't inclined to deface their rifles right before being killed or captured. The defacing took place after the war ended.
     
  13. ramx50

    ramx50 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2006
    Messages:
    417
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    Wakefield, MA
    Here are a few more. What is a monopod?
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  14. PatMcD

    PatMcD NES Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2005
    Messages:
    5,941
    Likes Received:
    854
    Location:
    Maine
    It's your typical Type 99. Ground Mum, missing monopod and sight wings.
     
  15. m44

    m44 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2008
    Messages:
    1,088
    Likes Received:
    22
    Location:
    Holland,Mass
    The marking before the serial number is probably a kana character indicating what series it is. My guess (without seeing pictures of the character) Is that it is probably somewhere in between the 1st and the 5th series.
     
  16. ramx50

    ramx50 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2006
    Messages:
    417
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    Wakefield, MA
    Yes and by looking at the chart on the link that JonJ posted the mark indicates it is a series 2
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2009
  17. USMA-82

    USMA-82 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2005
    Messages:
    3,367
    Likes Received:
    257
    Location:
    Between 290, 495 & the Mass Pike
  18. vellnueve

    vellnueve Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2006
    Messages:
    16,917
    Likes Received:
    749
    Location:
    BIOT
    A bipod has two legs.

    A monopod has one leg.

    Same purpose.
     
  19. terraformer

    terraformer NES Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2008
    Messages:
    16,653
    Likes Received:
    1,847
    And the monopod was "good" if they decided to shoot at moving targets. Well, in theory anyway.
     
  20. WILDCATT

    WILDCATT Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2008
    Messages:
    663
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    MANNING SC
    jap 99

    that one is in 7.7 cal.made after 1939,does not have the anti aircraft wing not did it ever.
     

Share This Page