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Home FFL In Massachusetts

Dakar652 said:
if this ends up being something I'm good at to the point people will pay me to do it and can make a little money while enjoying my favorite hobby, I think it might be worth the trouble/expense.
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Therein lies the rub. Your intent is to be “in the business” of doing this and that alone sets you into the realm of the FFL. Crackpot has your answer.
 
Dakar652 said:
that's just ridiculous. how is that any different than taking someone to the range and letting them shoot one of your firearms.

i'm not actually asking this question...it's just ludicrous that they set that double standard.
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I think in some cases its just because people let them get away with it (BATFE demanding things not required by law) but its the old problem...

-get pushed around by BATFE, pay a lawyer to help you fight them, and MAYBE win, and even if you win you n ever get the $$$$$ you spent on that attorney back).
-get pushed around by BATFE, just do whatever they tell you and the problem goes away.

Most end up picking the 2nd option.

-Mike
 
It is possible to get a home FFL without a MA dealers or gunsmith license, but you would not be able to do any sales (except to out of state FFLs, or up to 4 a year). The home FFL would also cover acting as a gunwriter/photographer/review. But, you won't be selling retail or gunsmithing without the MA license that is not issued to home addresses. And, the FFL alone does not get one a KMA AW ban exemption. Also, Healy revoked that exemption for post her-ban EBRs by fiat.
 
I believe one of the conditions of Applying for an FFL is you are agreeing that you will obtain all the local/state licenses within X days of receiving your FFL and prior to conducting any business.
 
Bearcatbirddog said:
I believe one of the conditions of Applying for an FFL is you are agreeing that you will obtain all the local/state licenses within X days of receiving your FFL and prior to conducting any business.
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Close, but it's actually "Within 30 days after the application is approved, the business/activity will comply with the requirements of State and local law applicable to the conduct of the business/activity."

You don't need the state licenses to hold an FFL, but you are then highly limited to what you can do in-state.
 
I like the idea of just selling everything BUT the gun. Barrels, sights, triggers, grips, clothes, lights, magazines, etc. Isn't all the money in the accessories anyhow?
 
matt2491 said:
You don't need the state licenses to hold an FFL, but you are then highly limited to what you can do in-state.
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Exactly, but there are things you can do.

The BATFE issued a ruling that gun writers, consultants, and photographers can only receive guns directly from a manufacturer without the use of an FFL if they are a W2 employee. Previously, 1099 employees qualified as well. The ruling went on to say that such persons, paid or volunteer, should obtain an FFL. By specifically including "volunteer" in that list, the BATFE has created an obscure, but specific, case where one can obtain an FFL without expressing a profit motive.
 
Bearcatbirddog said:
I believe one of the conditions of Applying for an FFL is you are agreeing that you will obtain all the local/state licenses within X days of receiving your FFL and prior to conducting any business.
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Right. And if you don't intend to do retail transfers, then a MA license is not necessary for you to do business in full compliance with state and federal law.

I know a MA resident with a home based 07 FFL who has done a fair amount of interstate silencer sales.

He says its far far better than either selling guns or silencers at retail because.
1) Since its an interstate sale, he is transferring the silencer to another dealer on a Form 3, which takes a couple of weeks. So he doesn't have to deal with the buyer calling every month to see if the stamp came back.
2) Silencers are little tubes that fit nicely into little boxes. They are easy, cheap, and simple to store and ship.
3) He can make more on a silencer than he can on just about any gun.
4) he doesn't have people he doesn't know coming to his house.

Don

p.s. Silencers are legal for 07 FFLs.
Section 10A
 
drgrant said:
You NEED an FFL to do this. No exceptions.

BATFE doesn't care even if the owner is standing right there. Even though its supposed to be legal, if they find out about it, and you have no license, you're f***ed.

That's why gunsmiths, etc, who don't have licenses will often operate "under" someone else's FFL.

There was a company that used to do laser engraving of guns around here. They had no FFL, but they were willing to work on your gun while you basically waited on premises. Some shithead at BATFE found out about it and they got threatened with an indictment or similar, they stopped touching guns altogether after that.

-Mike
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LMFAO Harry still has my lower on his webpage http://gnwlaser.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/A-15-laser-engraved-Dont-tread-on-me.jpg
 
Palladin - I agree with you when it comes to engraving. Its not gunsmithing.

Shoot. I had my first NFA item engraved at a place in a mall that did chalices and platters. It never left my sight so no FFL.
 
CrackPot said:
07 FFL with SOT, yes. SOT is $500 per year (July 1 to June 30). Any NFA items require the SOT
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also can I do this from my residence or will I need to lease a building to make it a business/store front? Sorry just trying to get things figured out there seems to be a lot of people saying yes and no
 
Yes and no.

Yes you can, but as a practical matter, MA will not issue the necessary state licences to a home based business.

Requires commercial zone.

See One Eyed Jack on this site if you're mid state.
 
07 FFL with SOT, yes. SOT is $500 per year (July 1 to June 30). Any NFA items require the SOT
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And, if you intend to sell any firearms (including non-NFA) or NFA items, you need an ITAR registration at $2250/year even you do not plan on any export sales..
 
CrackPot said:
07 FFL with SOT, yes. SOT is $500 per year (July 1 to June 30). Any NFA items require the SOT
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This is incorrect.
You do NOT need to have a SOT to possess NFA items in your bound book. If you haven't paid your SOT (special occupational tax) you simply will then need to pay a $200 tax for every NFA item you transfer or make.

Think of the SOT as an "all you can eat" tax. You pay the $500/yr rather than a-la-carte, $200 per item.
 
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Remember, that an 07 FFL running out his business out of his home WITHOUT a SOT can legally:

1) sell items on gunbroker to people out of state the same as someone with a state license. The item ships to the buyers local licensee (FFL) who handles the transfer.
2) sell items to in-state people, provided he brings or ships the items to another FFL with a state license to handle the transfer.
3) possess silencers.

All for $50 per year.
 
dcmdon said:
Remember, that an 07 FFL running out his business out of his home WITHOUT a SOT can legally:

1) sell items on gunbroker to people out of state the same as someone with a state license. The item ships to the buyers local licensee (FFL) who handles the transfer.
2) sell items to in-state people, provided he brings or ships the items to another FFL with a state license to handle the transfer.
3) possess silencers.

All for $50 per year.
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Anyone with an LTC however can do #1 and #2 without the 07 FFL
Of course #1 is a bit easier being an FFL as some other FFL's will not take transfers from anyone other than from another FFL
 
bgoum said:
Anyone with an LTC however can do #1 and #2 without the 07 FFL
Of course #1 is a bit easier being an FFL as some other FFL's will not take transfers from anyone other than from another FFL
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Not true. While you can sell a few per year without a FFL. Once you really make it a business, you need to have an 01 or 07.

Also, you seem to have forgotten the fact that no wholesaler will give you an account if you don't have an FFL.
 
dcmdon said:
Not true. While you can sell a few per year without a FFL. Once you really make it a business, you need to have an 01 or 07.

Also, you seem to have forgotten the fact that no wholesaler will give you an account if you don't have an FFL.
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If you want to make it a business then yes, agreed. I have a business and an 07.
I could sell on gunbroker however without a business or an 07 until I reach the ATF magic number of "being in the business".
And one could sell more than a few per year in state if they did the transfers at an FFL as you stated. The limit of 4 per year in MA is for FTF sales.
And when were we talking about wholesalers again?
 
bgoum said:
If you want to make it a business then yes, agreed. I have a business and an 07.
I could sell on gunbroker however without a business or an 07 until I reach the ATF magic number of "being in the business".
And one could sell more than a few per year in state if they did the transfers at an FFL as you stated. The limit of 4 per year in MA is for FTF sales.
And when were we talking about wholesalers again?
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You could sell a thousand guns in one year if you are prepared to prove you aren't "doing business".

Hypothetical: You've been collecting firearms for years, simply enjoying your hobby. Maybe selling one or three now and then and buying some more desirable models.

A time comes, maybe you lose your job and need the money. Marry a gal that hates guns. Or even simply decide you don't have time anymore and SOMEBODY should be enjoying them. Sell them. Selling them directly is simply smart, avoiding a couple dozen grand$ in pointless fees. That isn't doing business. Chances are with as extreme an example as that, though, you'll be justifying the sales to somebody.

But, do it again and chances are you won't have to worry about room and board for a while.
 
Reviving old thread for a question. Getting a home based FFL for primarily online out of state sales, it should be fine if it doesn’t run afoul of zoning. However I spoke to the town planner in Seekonk and he stated that shipping in receiving packages would likely run afoul. I also checked Swansea but it’s unclear and I need to file a form and they will check based on their interpretation of the zoning bylaws.

Anyone have any experience with Swansea? At least it wasn’t a straight “No”. Otherwise I’d have to go before the planning board if they determine it’s not an acceptable use.-Mat

https://www.town.swansea.ma.us/sites/swanseama/files/uploads/2018_zoning_by-law.pdf
 
Coyote33 said:
OK, I lost my secret decoder ring. What are SOT and ITAR?
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special occupational tax. This is the $500 a year tax an FFL pays to be able to handle NFA items

international traffic in arms regulations. this no longer applies to FFLs that are purely domestic. There was a period of time where...
 
So it used to not apply to 07 FFLs at all. Then some bright person decided it did and we lived with that over our heads. About a year ago, there was a clarification and it no longer applies to most 07s. I would have to go digging to find the article/ruling/whatever. All I know is I stopped worrying about it.
 

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