1986 FBI Miami shootout recreation vid

[Picton]

Got it!
I should start a new thread for each yearly event that should be recognized to keep you whiners from complaining.

Nah, I don't really mind; it's nice to see these old names again.

Just something I noticed, is all.

 

[Andy in NH]

Can you give the quick summary? Does Mireles admit how badly they all screwed up?

I listened to it when the podcast first came out and don't recall many of those details.

I think he does mention the reason why more of them didn't have long guns and that one of the long gun guys was in getting a coffee (or using the bathroom) when the call came in; he didn't hear it initially because he didn't have a handheld radio - only a radio in the car.

 

[Andy in NH]

Nah, I don't really mind; it's nice to see these old names again.

Just something I noticed, is all.

No worries. It's all good!

 

[Agnotology]

In the event of someone bumping into this thread again, Paul Harrell did best short format break down of the shooting IMO.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iv8cByaVyNQ&ab_channel=PaulHarrell

 

[sstom]

Paul Harrel does a good video on it

 

[Picton]

Paul Harrel does a good video on it

...scroll up one slot...

 

[Andy in NH]

Link to FBI's record vault (FOIA) on the Miami Shooting: here.

 

[Andy in NH]

I was in a Rangemaster class where before a string of fire Tom Givens would tell the class, "This is how far Special Agent Grogan was when he fired at..." and then before another string, "This is how far Special Agent McNeil was when he fired at..." and again before another, "This is how far away Special Agent Orrantia was when he fired at..."

I remember thinking that those distances weren't really that far and the effect that extreme stress has on human performance.

 

[KBCraig]

I was in a Rangemaster class where before a string of fire Tom Givens would tell the class, "This is how far Special Agent Grogan was when he fired at..." and then before another string, "This is how far Special Agent McNeil was when he fired at..." and again before another, "This is how far away Special Agent Orrantia was when he fired at..."

I remember thinking that those distances weren't really that far and the effect that extreme stress has on human performance.

Also: running around without your gun because it flew off the seat is not a sound tactical approach.

 

[xtry51]

And maybe don't have coworkers who are out banging women when they are supposed to be working as your backup?

 

[LittleCalm]

Maybe noted above, but one takeaway by the FBI was that it would not in the future seek to engage in close quarter shootouts around vehicles and would would not engage in the tactic of using chase cars to ram/force a target vehicle off the road. It concluded that close quarter combat around vehicles was way to unpredictable. Better to maintain distance in any ensuing shoot out.

 

[Andy in NH]

And maybe don't have coworkers who are out banging women when they are supposed to be working as your backup?

Haven't heard that one before. Where are those details?

 

[Andy in NH]

Maybe noted above, but one takeaway by the FBI was that it would not in the future seek to engage in close quarter shootouts around vehicles and would would not engage in the tactic of using chase cars to ram/force a target vehicle off the road. It concluded that close quarter combat around vehicles was way to unpredictable. Better to maintain distance in any ensuing shoot out.

IIRC, the decision to ram was made to keep the suspects from firing at an FBI car that was approaching from the opposite direction and to keep the suspects on the back road instead of getting back to the heavy traffic on the Dixieland Highway.

 

[xtry51]

I thought one of the agents was with a waitress when the chase started and he had been known to be banging her.

 

[Andy in NH]

I thought one of the agents was with a waitress when the chase started and he had been known to be banging her.

Maybe true, maybe not?

I've just never been aware of that information (yet) in any of the reading or interviews on the event.

 

[Agnotology]

And maybe don't have coworkers who are out banging women when they are supposed to be working as your backup?

Pretty sure every single one of the guys involved that shooting would have not only preferred, but loved to have started it with post-nut clarity.

 

[KBCraig]

I thought one of the agents was with a waitress when the chase started and he had been known to be banging her.

That was an element in John Ross's novel "Unintended Consequences", but he mixed truth and artistic license with several based-on-true-cases incidents.

In his novelized version, two agents were tag-teaming a waitress.

 

[Picton]

In his novelized version, two agents were tag-teaming a waitress.

 

[SS1]

Does not beat this...

1997 North Hollywood bank robbery: A look at one of the most prolific gun battles in LA's history

It started as one of the most brazen heists in L.A. history. It ended in a war on the streets of North Hollywood. Now 25 years later, we take a look back at the 44 minutes of terror that changed L.A. forever.

abc7.com

 

[xtry51]

That was an element in John Ross's novel "Unintended Consequences", but he mixed truth and artistic license with several based-on-true-cases incidents.

In his novelized version, two agents were tag-teaming a waitress.

Oh crap. Good call that probably is what I'm thinking of

 

[Andy in NH]

Bump.

Anniversary today.

 

[rogersmithiii]

Not sure if it's been posted here before or not, first time I've seen it.



Makes me want to re-think my using a PF-9 as a daily carry. Either that or it solidifies my thought that 7+1 rounds of 9mm is only to be used to get me the f*ck out of the situation and nothing more. I might just go back to carrying 26 rounds of 10mm

You don't need normal capacity magazines. Brandon says so.

 

[jkelly1229]

And maybe don't have coworkers who are out banging women when they are supposed to be working as your backup?

What's the point then