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US Army Bayonet My Modern Day "Bringback" from China!!!!

40 caliber

40 caliber

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Some of you that know me, know I travel to China for business on a regular basis. I just got back today from a 3 week tour. This time instead of rushing home, I had a friend take me away from the city of Shanghai and into more of "real China". I was for 3 days the only foreigner (non asian) guy to be seen.

We ended up in this small village in the province of Anhui. a beautiful area with jagged mountains, old villages and very poor people. This particular village is a little touristy but mostly visited only by Chinese. While walking through the city, i come across a bayonet marked with the U.S. Ordnance Bomb!!! I know nothing about bayonets other than CMP had M1 Garand Bayos for sale for $65 or so.

I pick up the bayonet and see it is marked 1942 with a Bomb on the hilt as well as the manufacturer AFH. (which turns out to be American Fork and Hoe). I buy it and look it up in my 3 year old Military firearms book. It says it is a Model 1942 for a 1903 Springfield. (experts weigh in if I am wrong-please) The book says it is valued at $200-$350!! Not bad since I only paid 200 chinese yuan ($32)

I have pictures, the chinese newspaper it was wrapped in and my plane ticket back from Shanghai. I dont know how that rates for Provenance but anyone got an idea if and how much it adds to value? Either way, it is a great story!!!!

One other thing? How did it get to China? We had some forces in shanghai prior to WWII with the french , Japanese and Russians I believe, but any other thoughts? Could it be from Vietnam, some war trophy from the other side from a fallen US soldier? i guess we won't know.
At least it is home now.......Enjoy


the town where I found it.

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The table and lady I bargained with. She wanted $50

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The Prize!!!! Note the Chinese newspaper

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Nice find but the Chinese scare me, because they are very good at making fakes
 
I did not say it is a fake. but the Chinese are very good at making fakes with rust and all.
 
PATRON said:
I did not say it is a fake. but the Chinese are very good at making fakes with rust and all.
Click to expand...

No but your comment insinuates it. I have been going to China for 4 years. I have a total of over 350 days in country. I have seen fake rolex's , cartier's gucci bags, NFL Patriot jersey, DVDs, fake terra cotta warriors and a slew of other stuff. This is the first time to see this in a small remote village in the middle of no where. When it comes to fakes you find them on every corner...and some place where they can get big money from the Laoweis (foreigners).... but hey ,,,, no worries. each to their own opnion.

Maninblue1861 said:
Is blade full 16" or cut to 10"?. Either way $32 a steal. FWIW looks legit to me as it looks like mine
Click to expand...

It is 10" . were these cut down by the service? the plastic scabbard fits the 10"
 
There were U.S. Forces in China in WWII as well as considerable military aid (remember the supply of China) "flying over the hump"...the fact that it showed up there is really neat, but not remarkable. If only that bayonet could talk. We also did military aid packages for Chiang Kai -shek after the war until he was driven off the mainland in 1949.

Since we did so many military aid packages in the WWII era and post WWII era, one can find US military equipment virtually everywhere in the world.

Congrats on a great find.
 
I'd think it's unlikely that something like this would be faked for variety reasons.

In terms of origin, actually there were tons of US goods and weapons that were shipped to all allies in the WWII. A lot of airplanes and tanks were even shipped packed with coats and personal side arms, you just had to drop people in. Since China was on our side, it's not surprising. The firearms would be confiscated or gone, but bayonet would be really useful. I bet that the lady does not even know what that bayonet is or even what any of the marks/letters are. It's just a really cool knife. It's a great find and whatever you discover, it was an awesome buy that would keep you occupied with research. Very nice!
 
That is not cut down from a 16" blade, and it is the real deal, down to the serrated plastic grips. Not uncommon, for the M1 Garand, but will fit a 1903.

Worth the coin, and the story adds flair. Really cool stuff.
 
Good find !!! Rarely you can find anything from US in Mainland china. Not even fake military items, unless it's LV, Versace, or Rolex.

Look like you were in the small village where they filmed Tom Cruise mission impossible. [wink]

The exchange rate for RMB seems to be inflated a lot. Used to be 7.7 RMB : 1 US.


Sent from my iPhone 5.
 
Cool. Half price CMP. I haven't been quite able to swallow $65 yet for one. Saving my $$ for a BIG purchase at the end of the summer.

MS

PS: Next time you're in country, look for one for me!
 
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You picked it up for about half price, if you are just comparing it to the CMP bayonets. But local gun shows are still asking (and getting) about $100 for bayonets in lesser quality than yours. Also, the CMP bayos that are being sold now are mostly the Greek returns that are parked black and have additional numbers stamped.
Bayonets like yours were also still used by our troops in the Korean War. It wouldn't be a stretch to discover that it came off the rifle of one of our troops who fought against the North Koreans & Chinese.

I think you have found a very nice specimen that any collector would like to own. I'm glad you brought it home.
 
OK I am not trying to be an ass, just looking to edjucat myself.A F H or as it was known as American fork and hoe like many other companies made bayonets for the military. Each company had a certain stamp that they used to mark the items that they made. I can not find any A F H stamp that matches 40 calibers bayonet. Now like I said, I am not trying to be an ass. I just trying to understand why the marking are not the same.
 

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Boris said:
I'd think it's unlikely that something like this would be faked for variety reasons.
Click to expand...

There are tons of Chinese repro bayonets out there. Some good, some really bad. Google will show you tons of pictures.

The stamp looks a little off to me, but I'm no expert.
 
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PATRON said:
OK I am not trying to be an ass, just looking to edjucat myself.A F H or as it was known as American fork and hoe like many other companies made bayonets for the military. Each company had a certain stamp that they used to mark the items that they made. I can not find any A F H stamp that matches 40 calibers bayonet. Now like I said, I am not trying to be an ass. I just trying to understand why the marking are not the same.
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IMG_0838.jpg


Patron, i am honestly asking with no anger or insincerety. How is this different than your first picture? given the bayo is 70 years old and the stamp was probably used to stamp 10s of thousands of bayonets during a war effort. It probably did not quality control stampings and reject them if they were off a little.(and frankly I see very little difference). Hey maybe i am a little too close to this but i can't see a difference. Martin08 says it is the real deal. good enough for me. if you want to see more, Gunbroker has a bunch for sale in pictures that look similar. Theres are actually cleaner one on gunbroker as they probably did not sit in a mud hut like this one did.
 
40 caliber said:
IMG_0838.jpg


Patron, i am honestly asking with no anger or insincerety. How is this different than your first picture? given the bayo is 70 years old and the stamp was probably used to stamp 10s of thousands of bayonets during a war effort. It probably did not quality control stampings and reject them if they were off a little.(and frankly I see very little difference). Hey maybe i am a little too close to this but i can't see a difference. Martin08 says it is the real deal. good enough for me. if you want to see more, Gunbroker has a bunch for sale in pictures that look similar. Theres are actually cleaner one on gunbroker as they probably did not sit in a mud hut like this one did.
Click to expand...

It looks like there's a square around the stamp that has a different finish than the rest of the blade. (Possible grinding?) The ordinance bomb doesn't have the inner circle. The shape of the flame is "off." Some of the letters / numbers look almost double struck.

I'd post the pictures over on the CMP forums and see what those guys think.
 
Why in this world would a Chinese forger go to any lengths to make up a dime/dozen AFH stamp on a real U.S. M1 bayonet. Wouldn't he forge it with an OL? Or at least a UFH.

Then, in order to get his best money, he placed it on a table in an obscure village, and had his peddler sell it for $25 under the going rate.

Maybe you should check to make sure that one isn't just steel plated, 40 cal. Probably is a bamboo core.

I agree with the record of the Chinese (Pakistani, Indian, and even American, etc.) as crafty knock-off artists. Just not on this most common of U.S. M1 bayonets.
 
martin08 said:
Why in this world would a Chinese forger go to any lengths to make up a dime/dozen AFH stamp on a real U.S. M1 bayonet. Wouldn't he forge it with an OL? Or at least a UFH.

Then, in order to get his best money, he placed it on a table in an obscure village, and had his peddler sell it for $25 under the going rate.

Maybe you should check to make sure that one isn't just steel plated, 40 cal. Probably is a bamboo core.

I agree with the record of the Chinese (Pakistani, Indian, and even American, etc.) as crafty knock-off artists. Just not on this most common of U.S. M1 bayonets.
Click to expand...

LOL, Thank you Martin. These guys got me looking at gunbroker for similar stampings and then pulling the knife out under bright lights, then it occured to me , why do i $%^& 'IN care? it is a good story on an interesting find, on a knife i don't plan to sell.
 
martin08 said:
Why in this world would a Chinese forger go to any lengths to make up a dime/dozen AFH stamp on a real U.S. M1 bayonet. Wouldn't he forge it with an OL? Or at least a UFH.

Then, in order to get his best money, he placed it on a table in an obscure village, and had his peddler sell it for $25 under the going rate.

Maybe you should check to make sure that one isn't just steel plated, 40 cal. Probably is a bamboo core.

I agree with the record of the Chinese (Pakistani, Indian, and even American, etc.) as crafty knock-off artists. Just not on this most common of U.S. M1 bayonets.
Click to expand...


There are Chinese replica M1 bayonets out there. That's a fact. (http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/mgr096-1.html) I don't know why they'd pick an AFH stamp. Maybe because it's less valuable and therefor might be under less scrutiny? Maybe they just didn't know any better? Maybe they happened to have those letters handy?

Look at the flame on top of the ordinance bomb - the real stamp has four "points" that point to the left. The one on this bayonet has more of a rounded flame, more like the one on the PAL version. It also doesn't have the circle inside the bomb.

The numeral 2 looks off as well.

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Unusual%20Marked%20008.jpg
 
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40 caliber said:
LOL, Thank you Martin. These guys got me looking at gunbroker for similar stampings and then pulling the knife out under bright lights, then it occured to me , why do i $%^& 'IN care? it is a good story on an interesting find, on a knife i don't plan to sell.
Click to expand...

It is an interesting find and a good story either way.
 
You have to understand, we are talking Americans from the 1940s, They had pride in thier work and there was a very high quality control.The overall stamping is to small for A F H.Each company that made the bayonets had a certain flaming bomb. The one on your bayonet is all wrong,take a good look at the flames that is not worn it is the way it was stamped.So you have a fake or a very rare stamped bayonet. I am glad you are not taking this the wrong way, I just know a few people that are sitting on what they thought where rare JAP. NCO swords and found they where just Chinese copies.
 

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