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  1. #21
    Administrator derek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by economist View Post
    But a traffic stop can happen to anybody, so you risk a fake LEO robbing or killing you, or, you can drive around looking for a better / safe place to stop and/or call the police all at the risk of pissing off a cop who has a lot of arbitrary power to make your life miserable.
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  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by OB1Kenobi View Post
    unmarked cruisers should NOT be used for traffic stops..... especially @ night.

    i would not pull over for unmarked cruiser in BFE / backwoods.
    I agree but some cities & towns do use umarked cruisers for traffic enforcement. However in these situations the officer is always in proper uniform. I would be extremely wary of an umarked car with an undercover officer doing traffic enforcement. Quite frankly it's not their job. If you serve the public in an undercover role then you should not be interacting with the public out of uniform if you are doing traffic enforcement.

    Oddly enough something a little like this happened to a friend of mine years ago while cutting through Otis AFB (pre-9/11). An MP tried to pull him over in an unmarked car by waving his flashlight out the window of his car. My friend kept driving until a MP in a marked car with blue lights got behind him. Once that happened he pulled right over and when asked why he didn't pull over for the other MP he simply said "would you pull over for a guy waving a flashlight out the window? He could be some looney trying to rob or kill me". The MP saw his point and sent him out the nearest exit to the base.
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  3. #23
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    I usually know what style un marked police vehicle they use, the Crown Vics, or something along those lines, and if you just look for grill lights, several other lights on top, not just one cheezy blue light, the way the front grill and lights seem to look, and especially if the guy coming over has a uniform on or not. Also, It seems as if though if I real officer was pulling you over, from my knowledge they dont seem to get out RIGHT away to come over. They sit for awhile call it, right some stuff down, etc. GRanted I know this could happen at night and its a bit harder, but I'd just use my eyes and ears to the best of my ability and go from there. I would do all this while NOT pulling over. Glad the lady is ok. Scum bag needs to get off the streets now.

  4. #24
    Jose
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    I've lived in several states where partially marked and totally unmarked police cars are used for traffic enforcement by the state patrol and sheriff's departments.

    In every single instance the officer emerging out of one is in full duty uniform. There is very, very little doubt who you are dealing with.

    IF the guy getting out is not in full, recognizable uniform, I will hit the road again while calling 911 and will pull over once a second cruiser shows up with uniforms on board.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by economist View Post
    That makes a lot of sense, but you just know a real officer is going to be very pissed if that happens. That's a big part of the problem as I see it. Who do you fear more, some random criminal or a really pissed off cop who just followed you 5 miles to the nearest police station? And for bonus points, say you are carrying too.
    That's just too bad. Suck it up, buttercup, there's not a lot of trust being thrown around lately, if they haven't noticed, lately. If I don't recognize an undercover, unmarked, or the actual cop, I'm making the 911 call to verify it is who they claim to be behind me. I'm sure they get notified that a verification call was made, so they have no reason to be pissed. They might have excuses galore to be pissy about me not instantly obeying like a servant, but tough s**t, it's my ass, not yours.

    Hope they catch this dirtbag and flog accordingly. It's crap like this story that creates the additional paranoia <shiver>, I'm glad she was OK, relatively speaking. Probably pretty spooked afterwards, though.
    Last edited by joeendris; 10-26-2011 at 11:06 AM.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by xtry51 View Post
    Dial 911 and have them either confirm its an officer behind you or have them guide you to the nearest police station.

    If there's any doubt don't stop at least until you get to a populated area.
    I was with you until your last sentence.
    I've explained to my wife, and she's agreed to never EVER stop for an unmarked car. In CT, troopers on traffic detail must put their light bars on their cars.

    Our agreed upon process is to pull into the right lane, if on the highway, and dial 911 and ask to be connected to the dispatcher that the officer would be talking to.
    The dispatcher will know if the cop is real because he will be talking to the cop behind you if its real.

    I don't really care if it pisses off the cop. My family's safety comes first.
    If a CT officer is following protocol, this will not be an issue because the car will have a lightbar on it.

    Don

    p.s. don't be afraid to call, the cops are VERY eager to follow up on anyone impersonating. I once had a car try to pull me over with nothing more than wig wags. Eventually they just passed me. I was on the phone with 911 and they asked me if I could follow the other car safely. I was happy to help. I was pissed. Eventually a we passed a cop waiting on an entrance ramp and he pulled the two guys over. I don't know what happened to them, but I definitely remember the dispatcher getting very eager to catch the guys, when I told them what happened.

  7. #27
    NES Member shadow2641's Avatar
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    I know this is kind of an older thread but I just wanted to throw my two cents in. As a 911 dispatcher I can say I have never received any of these calls but I do see a flaw in dialing 911. You have to remember (and this at least applies to the state of Massachusetts) if you dial 911 from your cell phone you are going to be connected to one of two state police call centers before you are transferred to the proper town/police agency....and then if you don't know what town you are in you can get connected to the wrong town (or in my case I usually get calls for Eastham, and I work in Easton). So you might be looking at a few minutes until you get the proper police station. Granted most undercover cruisers are not doing motor vehicle stops and if they do they are usually with a marked cruiser....low pro cruisers all day long, but they are still marked. I've never posed this question to any of the police officers in my life, but I would probably put my hazards on and pull into a populated area/p-lot. It is a very scary situation, nonetheless.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by In God We Trust View Post
    I know in some states it is legal to continue driving to a secure location. Apparently in the people's republic of MA it is not. I found this on the Hatfield, MA police website:
    MYTH #6: An unmarked cruiser is trying to pull me over. Because I can't verify it is a real police officer I don't have to stop.
    FACT #6: Wrong. Many police agencies, including the Hatfield Police Department, use unmarked vehicles to patrol roads and conduct traffic stops. If a vehicle is trying to pull you over and it is displaying flashing or rotating blue lights then you are required by law to stop for it. If you are unsure about the legitimacy of the police officer approaching your vehicle, lock all your doors. Roll down the driver's window just enough to carry on a conversation through the window and pass your license and registration to the "officer". The officer is required by law to identify himself/herself as a police officer and have his/her badge displayed in a prominent location. Most police officers, including all Hatfield officers, also carry an official picture identification card issued by their department that you may ask to see, to verify his/her identity. If the officer is not in uniform or if you are in a very isolated or rural area, ask the officer to send another, marked cruiser with a uniformed officer to your location. Or ask the officer to follow you to the nearest police station or well-lit area. Once you have established that he/she is a police officer, you must comply with all lawful requests.
    .
    The red bolded text makes no sense

    The blue is another thing, does the Hatfield Police also believes a perpetrating officer wouldn't or couldn't also make up a FAKE ID ?

  9. #29
    NES Member xtry51's Avatar
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    It makes perfect sense. At least to people who really think gun laws work and criminals could never possibly shoot you on the side of the road or break your window with a crowbar/bat/baton because obviously your driver side window is completely invincible.
    Si vis pacem, para bellum - If you wish for peace, prepare for war

    Have you heard about the vast Libertarian conspiracy? We want to take over the government and then.... Leave you alone.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadow2641 View Post
    I know this is kind of an older thread but I just wanted to throw my two cents in. As a 911 dispatcher I can say I have never received any of these calls but I do see a flaw in dialing 911. You have to remember (and this at least applies to the state of Massachusetts) if you dial 911 from your cell phone you are going to be connected to one of two state police call centers before you are transferred to the proper town/police agency....and then if you don't know what town you are in you can get connected to the wrong town (or in my case I usually get calls for Eastham, and I work in Easton). So you might be looking at a few minutes until you get the proper police station. Granted most undercover cruisers are not doing motor vehicle stops and if they do they are usually with a marked cruiser....low pro cruisers all day long, but they are still marked. I've never posed this question to any of the police officers in my life, but I would probably put my hazards on and pull into a populated area/p-lot. It is a very scary situation, nonetheless.
    Your suggestion to pull over anyway is ridiculous. What good does a populated area do? People don't want to get involved. How involved do you think they will get if one party appears to be a LEO. The bottom line is that if you aren't sure its a cop, don't pull over. Your info re 911 is very helpful. Its good to know that it may take a few minutes to get to the correct PD. But again, if cops want to drive around in stealth, they deserve to be ignored. I live in a small town with a lot of volunteer firemen with blue light permits. Its common to see all kinds of cars all lit up. (It doesn't hurt that Whelen Engineering is 5 miles from my house and they effectively donate hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of lights and sirens to local first responders)

    When I see what appears to be a civilian vehicle all lit up I yield immediately. But I will not stop, and neither will my wife. I'm happy to let the chips fall where they may.

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